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Garlicdesign
Post subject: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 6:53 pm
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Hello everyone!

Rather than the full-fledged superdreadnought Salamis, Greece's entry into the Dreadnought era was originally to be a much more modest ship. The design was very original, combining six 356mm guns with a hull the size of a typical pre-dreadnought battleship. 21 knots speed were specified (Breyer states 23, but this seams not feasible on such a small hull loaded down with heavy guns), and armour was along the lines of an armoured cruiser, probably similar to Averof's, which was quite well protected for a cruiser. Why the German designers provided such a pronounced icebreaker bow for a ship which would likely never operate outside the Mediterranean beats me; they probably did it simply out of habit. Although the hull was to be built in Germany to a German design (somewhere I've read a very similar design was proposed by a British yard, but I have not found any pictures of that one), the guns were ordered in the the USA.

[ img ]

The design was dropped as soon as the Ottomans ordered superdreadnoughts of their own and replaced with the ultimate Salamis. With its compact size, relatively shallow draught and heavy long-ranged punch the design might have been interesting for scandinavian navies as well, but that is only my opinion.

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 6:55 pm
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really great work, nice to see this one joining the club as well.

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citizen lambda
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 7:36 pm
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Great drawing! Some interesting relief on the turrets and overall color work.

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Krakatoa
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 7:51 pm
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I have seen line drawings and artists 'impressions' of this. Good drawing GD.

From Wiki:
"Scientific American remarked that the ship would "not mark any particular advance in warship design, being, rather, an effort to combine the greatest defensive and offensive qualities with the least cost.""

The ship would have been prey for the battlecruisers that pre-date this ship. The UK already had the Lion type completing before this ship was laid down. Too slow, not enough armour. Mice for the "Splendid Cats" to play with.


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HyperHiggsHelix
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 8:26 pm
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That seems like a nice "little" ship. A great drawing too.

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odysseus1980
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 8:33 pm
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Agree with all above and glad to see this design here. Of course, wait for the full scale Salamis.


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Krakatoa
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 9:00 pm
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odysseus1980 wrote:
Agree with all above and glad to see this design here. Of course, wait for the full scale Salamis.
The full scale Salamis has been drawn some time ago by GD.


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csatahajos
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 28th, 2016, 9:30 pm
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Very nice and rare one, good job!!!

If you allow a comment I don't think this was an icebreaker-bow per se (nor was it on the german BBs). It was a so-called cut down bow profile used to reduce cross sectional area and coefficient at the bow plus quite probably it was also better suited for shallow waters. It had the negative effect of depriving the bow area of bouyancy so it was not really pursued later on as it was only useful in seas with really moderate weather (ie Mediterranean and Baltic sea).

One reason (my guess only) that they used this on the prelim design but not on the final one is that the prelim ship had no superfiring turret forward and therefore somewhat less weight on the bow side.


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emperor_andreas
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 29th, 2016, 2:05 am
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Very nice work!

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Hood
Post subject: Re: Salamis - Pre-designPosted: November 29th, 2016, 8:41 am
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Very nice work as ever GD. It's nice to see this never-were in SB format. The turret shading is interesting but done well and looks good.
I think it would have been an ok design for Greece, I don't think they would have ever set up a dreadnought vs. dreadnought match like the Great Powers were planning with their much larger fleets. As a coastal defence type lurking around the various Greek islands it would have been very suitable I think and more reasonable on the bank balance.

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