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knut 75
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: June 30th, 2020, 3:26 pm
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Hood
I really enjoy your Alternate RN work.
Have you posted links on the Secret Projects site as they really help a number of threads there. (I realise you probably have)


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Hood
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 16th, 2021, 1:24 pm
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Its amazing to think a year has passed since the last update here!
At last I have gotten around to drawing the amphibious ships I have had planned for some time, an LHD and a LPD class, combining the real Illustrious and Ocean into one hull and a better armed Bay-class as a true LPD/LSD. A new LSL will follow later.

Albion Class

[ img ]
HMS Albion, 2003

The Invincible-class escort cruisers had always had a secondary role as Commando carriers and as thoughts in the late 1980s turned to replacements, an increased amphibious role was sought as more ASW helicopters returned to the CVAs. Initial designs lacked a well deck, but this was added in 1997 to provide a superior amphibious capability but a bow sonar was retained for use as an ASW support ship to escort the new CVF strike carriers. Plans for three ships were scaled back to one, then grew again to two ships. These ships combine vehicle decks, command spaces, troop accommodation, a well deck, large hangar and hospital facilities as well as air-defence capability.
A similar export design was sold to Australia to be built as HMAS Canberra.

HMS Albion L12 commissioned July 2001
HMS Bulwark L13 commissioned September 2003

Displacement: 27,500 tons full load
Dimensions: 723ft 6in (oa), 674ft 6in (wl) length; 105ft beam; 26ft 6in draught (over sonar dome), 22ft (hull).
Machinery: One 48,000shp Rolls-Royce MT30 gas turbines plus two 15,600hp Wärtsilä 38 diesels, one bow thruster
Speed: 27kts (deep and clean)
Range: 9,000 nautical miles at 15kts
Armament:
2x16-cell VLS for GWS-27 Active Confessor SAMs, fire-control by two Type 912 directors (replaced by Sea Ceptor in 2018-19)
3x Starstreak CIWS mounts with 24x Starstreak SAMs each
4x1 30mm MSI-DSI gun mounts
Aircraft:
Hangar for up to;
12x Westland Merlin HM.3 and 6x Westland Lynx AH.6 (armed with TOW ATGW) in the amphibious role and can accommodate the Boeing-Vertol Chinook, or up to 18x Westland Merlin HM.2 in the ASW role
Capacity: 2x LCU or 4x LCVP in well deck; up to 100x vehicles; troop capacity 1,000-1,600
Radars:
1x Type 967/Type 968 air/surface search (replaced by BAe Artisan 3-D search radar in 2018-19)
1x Signaal Type 1046 long-range search radar
2x Type 1007 navigation radars
4x Type 1010 phased-array surface search radars
4x Gatekeeper EO/IR sensors
Type 2091 bow-mounted multi-function sonar

EW/Defences:
Thales UAT(16) ESM
2x Type 2199 Pillbox EW jammers
6x MAWS/DAS
2x CIRCM
4x Sea Gnat decoy launchers
1x Type 2170 UAD anti-torpedo decoy launcher
4x DLF(3) floating decoy launchers


Bay Class

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HMS Cardigan Bay, 1998

[ img ]
HMS Lyme Bay, 2020

[ img ]
HMS Morecambe Bay, 2021

Designed to replace the two Fearless-class LPDs during the late 1990s, the Bay-class offered a good self-defensive capability, including 76mm guns for defence and gunfire-support. They were designed originally to reinforce NATO’s northern flank in Norway. Two ships were planned but funding was found for a second pair to increase the Navy’s lifting capability in the post-Cold War era. The helicopter deck can support types up to Chinook size, further aft is a deck for use as an additional vehicle park or TEUs and could be used as an additional landing pad in emergencies. Full hospital facilities are also fitted. In 2021 HMS Morecambe Bay received a new VLS system to act as a Littoral Support Ship with the ability to fire SPEAR-EM land-attack missiles.

HMS Cardigan Bay L3006 commissioned March 1998
HMS Largs Bay L3007 commissioned May 1999
HMS Lyme Bay L3008 commissioned July 2001
HMS Morecambe Bay L3009 commissioned August 2001

Displacement: 16,000 tons full load
Dimensions: 590ft (oa), 553in (wl) length; 86ft 6in beam; 21ft 6in draught (hull)
Machinery: Two 9,000hp Wärtsilä 12V26 diesel generators plus two 6,000hp Wärtsilä 8L26 diesel generators, two azimuthing thrusters and one bow thruster
Speed: 18kts (deep and clean)
Range: 8,000 nautical miles at 15kts
Armament:
2x 76mm OTO Super Rapid gun mount, fire-control by 1x Sea Archer 30 (replaced by EOGCS from 2016)
2x16-cell VLS for GWS-25 Confessor SAMs, fire-control by one Marconi 1802SW director (replaced by Sea Ceptor in 2016-19, HMS Morecambe Bay refitted in 2020 with 3x8-cell Sylver A50 VLS for quad-packed CAMM and quad-packed Spear-ER SSMs)
2x Starstreak CIWS mounts with 24x Starstreak SAMs each (Martlet SSM capability added from 2016)
2x1 30mm MSI-DSI gun mounts
2x120mm Orkileon GAM-BO1 gun mounts (replaced by 25mm MSI-DSI Sigma 25 from 2016)
4x 12.7mm Leonardo Hitrole (from 2016)
Aircraft:
Hangar for 4x Westland Merlin HM.3 or Westland Lynx AH.6 (armed with TOW ATGW), flight deck can accommodate the Boeing-Vertol Chinook
Capacity: 1x LCU or 2x LCVP in well deck plus 4x LCVP or CB-90 assault craft in davits; can carry 2x Mexeflotes; 24x MBT or 150x vehicles and 200 tons of cargo; troop capacity 350-700
Radars:
1x Type 996 3-D radar (replaced by BAe Artisan 3-D search radar from 2016)
2x Type 1007 navigation radars
1x Type 1009 navigation radar (from 2016 3x Type 1009)
4x Gatekeeper EO/IR sensors

EW/Defences:
Marconi UAG ESM
2x Type 675 jammers (replaced by Type 2199 Pillbox EW jammers from 2012)
4x Sea Gnat decoy launchers (replaced by 2x12 Centurion decoy launchers from 2012)
1x Type 2170 UAD anti-torpedo decoy launcher (from 2012)
4x DLF(3) floating decoy launchers

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English Electric Canberra FD
Interwar RN Capital Ships
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odysseus1980
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 16th, 2021, 2:15 pm
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Wonderful and powerful ships, both much better from what OTL Britain ever had.

I remember a seen British version of Johan de Witt in old archives, but I would take this Bay Class instead.


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The Oncoming Storm
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 16th, 2021, 3:21 pm
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Superb work!


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GLACIESFIRE
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 16th, 2021, 8:32 pm
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Location: Back in Italy...
WOW!!! NICE IDEA!!!

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 17th, 2021, 3:53 am
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Nice to see this AU continuing :D Very good drawings!

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Rainmaker
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 17th, 2021, 4:55 pm
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Wow, incredible work Hood! This series keeps getting better and better with every entry. These vessels are certainly much more capable than what the RN fielded in the real world.

I am curious with regards to your Albion - class, these seem to be tremendously capable vessels, not unlike a British version of the Japanese Izumo - class in their warfighting capability, although with perhaps more of an amphibious role in mind. However, I'm surprised that the RN wouldn't consider fitting these vessels with an intrinsic fixed-wing VTOL capability from the outset, perhaps even a ski-jump, given the massive amount of deck space available.

I understand that in your AU the RN fields the CVA carriers so perhaps fielding an additional Harrier capability would be unnecessary/redundant, but I'm interested to know what your decision-making process was in omitting said capability.

Keep up the great work - cheers!


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erik_t
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 17th, 2021, 5:16 pm
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Bay is nice enough, but Albion is exceptional. I do have to wonder if those itty bitty anchors would be up to the task.


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odysseus1980
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 17th, 2021, 6:30 pm
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Indeed, Harrier is a very effective fighter.


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Hood
Post subject: Re: Alternate Royal Navy #2Posted: May 18th, 2021, 7:11 am
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Rainmaker wrote: *
Wow, incredible work Hood! This series keeps getting better and better with every entry. These vessels are certainly much more capable than what the RN fielded in the real world.

I am curious with regards to your Albion - class, these seem to be tremendously capable vessels, not unlike a British version of the Japanese Izumo - class in their warfighting capability, although with perhaps more of an amphibious role in mind. However, I'm surprised that the RN wouldn't consider fitting these vessels with an intrinsic fixed-wing VTOL capability from the outset, perhaps even a ski-jump, given the massive amount of deck space available.

I understand that in your AU the RN fields the CVA carriers so perhaps fielding an additional Harrier capability would be unnecessary/redundant, but I'm interested to know what your decision-making process was in omitting said capability.
I always claim this AU to be a multi-facetted one, you can either view it as a complete whole or each ship entry can be seen as a stand-alone entry to be inserted into a RL scenario to replace certain ships in the real inventory.

The ships are quite capable due to their origins as ASW escort carriers that morphed into an LHD, it felt wrong to leave off the sonar given the ASW role, its better to have it than to rely purely on the escorting screen or the towed-array ships further out. This ship was intended to carry Merlins to back up the towed-array frigates in the GIUK gap. In reality a Hot Cold War would likely have seen these occupied with the amphibious assault role to Norway, so there is a strong self-defence capability against Soviet air and submarine assets heading south from the Arctic bases.

In my grand over-arching AU narrative, there are two CVAs in the fleet so the RN did not bother with the Sea Harrier. It is likely that RAF Harriers could be embarked on short-term deployments, but it didn't seem worthwhile putting a ski-jump on just for that. Could it carry F-35B? Probably, though in this AU its possible the RAF doesn't have the F-35B. At one point in the drawing process I was planning a Sea Wolf battery at the forward end of the flight deck but went with the sponsons instead, so that also influenced my choice not to have a ski-jump.

I'm sure everyone has noticed a lack of carriers in the AU so far. Well its not because there won't be any, I just haven't made any firm decisions on what fixed-wing aircraft I will use 1950-2020 so until I settle that the carriers remain on my drawing board.
I have a few other concepts I want to explore first.
erik_t wrote: *
Bay is nice enough, but Albion is exceptional. I do have to wonder if those itty bitty anchors would be up to the task.
Grrr, Erik always gets to the heart of my weaknesses! Only kidding, I hate drawing anchors, so once I draw what I think is a good anchor I tend to copy paste it a lot! But yes, they do look a little puny and I might rejig them.

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Interwar RN Capital Ships
Super-Darings
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