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rundrewrun99
Post subject: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 29th, 2017, 9:20 pm
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Hey guys, I know that there have been a flurry of challenges lately, and that this probably seem a bit extraneous, but I am here with a challenge of my own! I think these are great exercises for the community, and are really good for understanding different ship types.
This challenge is going to be for modern arctic warfare vessels. These are going to be icebreaking warships, operating in winter ice in the far north atlantic and arctic circle (think northern Norway, north of Iceland, Greenland, Northern Hudson Bay).
Here are the requirements
1) The ship must be armed with a minimum of A main cannon (literally any caliber will do) and at the least one or two Heavy Machine Guns.
2) Minimum icebreaking levels. By the Polar Classification system it would be PC 3 (although PC 2 designs will be given great praise, and PC 1 designs will be godly)
3) Role requirements. This challenge is targeted towards surface ships only, and excludes submarines.
Thats it! Have fun!

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heuhen
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 29th, 2017, 10:36 pm
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so what you want is either this:

[ img ]

or this

[ img ]

Note: Nordkapp class are build as an command vessel that can be armed with Penguin ASuW missile and torpedoes and have it 57mm cannon upgraded to 3" twin


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rundrewrun99
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 29th, 2017, 10:51 pm
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Well yes, but I thought it might be interesting to put it out there and see what people come up with!

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Lazer_one
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 7:25 am
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... Uhmm ... I don't know if I will work on this topic...

BTW here below some hints about hull classifications for ice-strenghten ships

Meaning of ice class

Not all ships are built to an ice class. Building a ship to an ice class means that the hull must be thicker, and more scantlings (aggregate of girders, beams, and bulkheads resulting in stronger structural integrity) must be in place. Sea chests (openings in the hull for seawater intake) may need to be arranged differently depending on the class. Sea bays may also be required to ensure that the sea chest does not become blocked with ice. Most of the stronger classes require several forms of rudder and propeller protection. Two rudder are usually required, and strengthened propeller tips are often required in the stronger ice classes. More watertight bulkheads, in addition to those required by a ship's normal class, are usually required. In addition, heating arrangements for fuel tanks, ballast tanks, and other tanks vital to the ship's operation may also be required depending on the class.

Baltic Ice Classes (Finnish-Swedish Classes)
According to the Swedish Maritime Administration and the Finnish Transport Safety Agency regulations the merchant ships operating in the Baltic Sea are divided into six ice classes based on requirements performance in ice. The Finnish-Swedish ice class rules have been recognized internationally by classification agencies.
Ships of the highest ice class, 1A Super, are designed to operate in difficult ice conditions mainly without icebreaker assistance while ships of lower ice classes 1A, 1B and 1C are assumed to rely on icebreaker assistance. In addition there are ice class 2 for steel-hulled ships with no ice strengthening that are capable of operating independently in very light ice conditions and class 3 for vessels that do not belong to any other class such as barges.

IACS Polar Class
The IACS has established seven different Polar Class corresponding to operational capability and strength of the vessel. Ships with sufficient power and strength to undertake "aggressive operations in ice-covered waters", such as escort and ice management operations, can be assigned an additional notation "Icebreaker".
The lowest Polar Classes (PC 6 and PC 7) are roughly equivalent to the two highest Finnish-Swedish ice classes (ICE 1A Super and ICE 1A, respectively). However, unlike the Baltic ice classes intended for operation only in first-year sea ice, even the lowest Polar Classes consider the possibility of encountering multi-year ice ("old ice inclusions").

Russian Maritime Register of Shipping
The Russian Maritime Register of Shipping (RMRS), established in 1913, has a long history of classing icebreakers and ice-strengthened vessels, and today maintains its own set of ice class rules for vessels navigating in freezing non-Arctic and Arctic seas. Out of about 5,000 vessels classified by the RMRS, over 3,200 are strengthened for navigation in ice and 300 of these have an ice class intended for operations in Arctic waters.
The RMRS ice class rules have been revised and the class notations changed several times over the years. As of 2017, the ice classes are divided to non-Arctic, Arctic and icebreaker classes.
The ice class notation is followed by a number which denotes the level of ice strengthening: Ice1 to Ice3 for non-Arctic ships, Arc4 to Arc9 for Arctic ships, and Icebreaker6 to Icebreaker9 for icebreakers.
These ice classes can be assigned in parallel with the Finnish-Swedish ice class and/or the IACS Polar Class, provided the vessel complies with all applicable rules. The selection of ice class is based on the operating area in the Russian Arctic, time of year, ice conditions, operating tactics, and whether the vessel operates under icebreaker escort or independently. In addition, icebreaker classes have additional requirements for minimum shaft power and icebreaking capability.

American Bureau of Shipping
The American Bureau of Shipping has a system of ice classes which includes classes A5 through A0; B0, C0, and D0. A5 class is the strongest built of the classes, with D0 being the weakest. All other major classification societies have a similar system of ice classes, and converting between ice classes is relatively easy. In most cases only the names of the classes are changed and the specifics of the Arctic class are identical. ABS Class A5 is the only Arctic Class that may act independently in extreme Arctic waters with no limitations. Other classes are subject to limitations on time of year, required escort (always with a vessel of higher ice class) and ice conditions.
The ABS database includes hundreds of Arctic Ice Classed ships, including many Arctic Research Vessels and the entire productions of certain shipyards.


Baltic Ice Classes (Finnish-Swedish Classes)
ICE 1A Super Minimum speed of 5 knots in a broken brash ice channel with a thickness of 1.0 m in the middle and a consolidated (refrozen) ice layer of 0.1 m.
ICE 1A Minimum speed of 5 knots in a non-consolidated ice channels with a thickness of 1.0 m
ICE 1B Minimum speed of 5 knots in a non-consolidated ice channels with a thickness of 0.8 m
ICE 1C Minimum speed of 5 knots in a non-consolidated ice channels with a thickness of 0.6 m
ICE 2 Steel-hulled ships with no ice strengthening capable of independent operation in very light ice
ICE 3 Vessel not belonging to the other classes


American Bureau of Shipping
PC 1 Year-round operation in all polar waters
PC 2 Year-round operation in moderate multi-year ice conditions
PC 3 Year-round operation in second-year ice which may include multi-year ice inclusions.
PC 4 Year-round operation in thick first-year ice which may include old ice inclusions
PC 5 Year-round operation in medium first-year ice which may include old ice inclusions
PC 6 Summer/autumn operation in medium first-year ice which may include old ice inclusions
PC 7 Summer/autumn operation in thin first-year ice which may include old ice inclusions

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Lazer_one
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 7:48 am
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Nowaday it is quite difficult to think something better and more effective than the russian Project 23550.
Maybe it could be taken into account a couple of hovercrafts instead of the two patrol boats (but I would not do it)
PS: the containers should be seen as "armed" ones

[ img ]

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sebu
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 10:28 am
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Lazer_one wrote: *
... Uhmm ... I don't know if I will work on this topic...

The lowest Polar Classes (PC 6 and PC 7) are roughly equivalent to the two highest Finnish-Swedish ice classes (ICE 1A Super and ICE 1A, respectively). However, unlike the Baltic ice classes intended for operation only in first-year sea ice, even the lowest Polar Classes consider the possibility of encountering multi-year ice ("old ice inclusions").


First: Lazer: you're going to take part in this anyway, since most of us are going to kitbash your designs :)
Second: Thanks for the "hints"; really instructive. I thought 1A Super can break almost anything... One question though: Is the IACS Polar class classification the same as the American Bureau of Shipping-classification?
Third: I'm going to take part in this challenge. I see it's an obligation for me; as a Finn ;)


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Lazer_one
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 11:59 am
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sebu wrote: *
Lazer_one wrote: *
... Uhmm ... I don't know if I will work on this topic...

The lowest Polar Classes (PC 6 and PC 7) are roughly equivalent to the two highest Finnish-Swedish ice classes (ICE 1A Super and ICE 1A, respectively). However, unlike the Baltic ice classes intended for operation only in first-year sea ice, even the lowest Polar Classes consider the possibility of encountering multi-year ice ("old ice inclusions").


First: Lazer: you're going to take part in this anyway, since most of us are going to kitbash your designs :) Thanks...
Second: Thanks for the "hints"; really instructive. I thought 1A Super can break almost anything... One question though: Is the IACS Polar class classification the same as the American Bureau of Shipping-classification? I find a useful table here http://www.bsis-ice.de/material/table_iceclasses.pdf
Third: I'm going to take part in this challenge. I see it's an obligation for me; as a Finn ;) Definetely it is a MUST !


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sebu
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 1:58 pm
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Well: I'm still a bit confused of those different classifications...
But let's go on... An ancient design with a minimum armored "peace time" configuration.

[ img ]


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heuhen
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 2:16 pm
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Lazer_one wrote: *
sebu wrote: *
Lazer_one wrote: *
... Uhmm ... I don't know if I will work on this topic...

The lowest Polar Classes (PC 6 and PC 7) are roughly equivalent to the two highest Finnish-Swedish ice classes (ICE 1A Super and ICE 1A, respectively). However, unlike the Baltic ice classes intended for operation only in first-year sea ice, even the lowest Polar Classes consider the possibility of encountering multi-year ice ("old ice inclusions").


First: Lazer: you're going to take part in this anyway, since most of us are going to kitbash your designs :) Thanks...
Second: Thanks for the "hints"; really instructive. I thought 1A Super can break almost anything... One question though: Is the IACS Polar class classification the same as the American Bureau of Shipping-classification? I find a useful table here http://www.bsis-ice.de/material/table_iceclasses.pdf
Third: I'm going to take part in this challenge. I see it's an obligation for me; as a Finn ;) Definetely it is a MUST !





We also have DNV GL (Det Norske Veritas (Norway) and Germanischer Lloyd (Germany))

Don't forget DNV Polar-10 (NoCGV Svalbard), Polar-20 (icebreaker Oden) and Polar-30

Icebreakers and Ice Strengthened Vessels:

ICE-1A* (or -1A or -1B or -1C) - Vessel which may operate in channels prepared by icebreakers and/or in open waters with smaller ice floes. The Rules are considered to meet the Finnish-Swedish ice class regulations for corresponding classes, and the Canadian arctic regulations for type A,B,C and D ships, respectively.

-1A* - Extreme ice conditions. Ice floes of thickness 1.0 m are anticipated

-1A - Severe ice conditions. Ice floes of thickness 0.8 m are anticipated

-1B - Medium ice conditions. Ice floes of thickness 0.6 m are anticipated

-1C - Light ice conditions. Ice floes of thickness 0.4 m are anticipated

ICE-1A*F - Vessels complying with ice class ICE-1A* and additionally strengthened for regular service in ice-infested waters, to a certain degree independent of ice breaker assistance
ICE-C - Vessel which may operate in light ice conditions

ICE-05 (or -10 or -15) - Vessels intended for ice breaking, built for another main purpose. Ice conditions: Winter ice with pressure ridges. No ramming anticipated.

POLAR-10 (or -20 or -30) - Vessels intended for ice breaking, built for another main purpose. Ice conditions: Winter ice with multi-year ice-floes and glacial ice inclusions. Accidental ramming. Figures indicate nominal ice thickness in dm. Intermediate values may occur.

Icebreaker - Vessels intended for ice breaking as main purpose. Used in combination with ICE - 05 (or - 10 or - 15) or with POLAR - 10 (or - 20 or - 30). Repeated ramming.

ICE - A* ( or - A or - B) (previous class notations) - Vessels which may operate in ice infested waters

Ice Breaker (previous class notation) - Vessel for breaking ice

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rundrewrun99
Post subject: Re: Arctic/Icebreaking Warship ChallengePosted: December 30th, 2017, 4:22 pm
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sebu wrote: *
Well: I'm still a bit confused of those different classifications...
But let's go on... An ancient design with a minimum armored "peace time" configuration.

[ img ]
Hey Sebu! Is this a real ship or a neverbuild design? I am merely unfamiliar with it haha

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