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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 4th, 2020, 4:38 pm
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Joined: December 29th, 2015, 1:22 am
The last class of pre-dreadnought battleships in the Bahtiyaran Navy built before the advent of the dreadnought forced a worldwide shift to all-big-gun batteries, rendering her obsolete. Laid down in 504 K.E. and commissioned in 507-508 K.E., they were rendered obsolete immediately upon completion by foreign dreadnoughts. Transferred to a quiet, secondary theater of operations in 512 K.E. at the onset of the Great War, they saw limited action against enemy warships and spent most of their lives performing gunfire support. After the end of the war they were sold off to the Moravian Navy, and sunk or scrapped in later conflicts.

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Namesake: The battle of Osmakoyun (Osmakoyun Savasi in Bahtiyaran), was a major clash in 361 K.E. involving a large Rurikan Army, against a small cadre of elite Bahtiyaran Janissary cavalry. By a stroke of luck, the Rurikans had evaded the bulk of the main Bahtiyaran army that had marched out to intercept them, and were marching on the capital of Nassira, which lay largely undefended.
Under the command of General Serkan Zarakolu, a regiment of 2000 cavalry engaged 25,000 enemy soldiers, most of whom were on foot. With the cavalry making aggressive flanking attacks against the weaker units of the enemy force and threatening their supply train, the Rurikan army was forced to stop and fight to throw off their harassers at the village of Osmakoyun.
For six hours, Zarakolu and his riders bit at the sides of the massive formation, making attacks at a full gallop to bait the enemy ranks into firing their muskets outside of effective range, then charging in for sabre strikes. Eventually however, the Bahtiyaran Janissaries had accumulated a large number of wounded and were forced to withdraw under cover of darkness.
In the intervening hours, a message runner dispatched by Zarakolu reached the main body of the Bahtiyaran Army that had marched earlier that day. General Kaldirim had a precious few hours to reverse course and get his army back into the city to prepare for the siege. The following Siege of Nassira would be decisive in the outcome of the war.

Background: Design work on a new battleship class began after the Mareşal Safar al-Aydin class were finalized and well underway in their construction. By 502 K.E. the Bahtiyar Dominion had been building metal-clad warships for over three decades. The latest class of battleships, laid down at the beginning of the year 501, were representative of the doctrine that had driven Bahityaran ship design since the advent of the torpedo. It would not be exaggeration to say that the self-propelled steam torpedo was an overnight revolution in the Bahtiyaran Navy. From the day the Admiralty was aware of it, the torpedo was viewed as the death knell of heavily armored, slow ships, as a slow moving ship could be surrounded and destroyed by torpedo-armed small craft, which could strike below the waterline and bypass any amount of armor a ship could carry to protect her against guns.

The Mareşal Safar al-Aydin class ships embodied the Bahtiyaran response to this threat that had been taken since the 480s. With a top speed of 21 knots, a high speed shared by the previous two classes, they were the fastest battleships in the world when commissioned in 504. They bristled with quick-firing secondary guns, boasting a total of thirty-two 6-inch weapons, with each side of the ship having sixteen ready to bear against the enemy. They were also the first large ships commissioned as-built with 3-inch guns, a new close-in defense weapon to replace the batteries of 3 and 6 pounder small guns that were rendered obsolete by the meteoric rise in the size and speed of torpedo craft.
Despite all this, these ships were largely unsatisfactory to the Bahtiyaran Admiralty. Previous battleships had followed a trend of two or four large caliber (usually 12-inch), guns supplanted by the maximum available battery of 6-inch quick firing guns that could be fitted into the dimensions of the hull. This was a pattern repeated on the Mareşal Safar al-Aydin class, but this time the lack of heavy secondaries in favor of a large barrel count of small guns was seen as a disadvantage rather than a virtue. This was due to significant advances made in large caliber gun technology in recent years. Merely a decade earlier, most large caliber weapons could take as many as five minutes to ready up a single shell for firing. This made them impractical for use as the primary damage-dealers against enemy warships. But by 502 K.E., there were many 12-inch gun designs in service, including in the Bahtiyaran Navy, that could complete their reloading in under a minute. And many 8 and 10-inch guns could fire multiple times in the span of a single minute.

The greatly increased effectiveness of heavy caliber guns did not go unnoticed by the Bahtiyar Dominion, but this had to be weighed against the threat of torpedo attack. Installing more heavy guns to use against capital ships would mean fewer rapid firing weapons capable of stopping an incoming torpedo boat. This was compounded by the fact that large turrets of the time lacked a means to traverse precisely enough to accurately fire at fast moving targets, further reducing the effect of heavy guns against torpedo craft. The decision to retain the large farms of 6-inch guns on the Mareşal Safar al-Aydin-class was made reluctantly, and it was repeatedly suggested that her upper battery of twin 6-inch turrets should be traded for 8-inch singles to supplement her anti-capital ship firepower.

While this was going on, however, the Navy’s dissatisfaction with the design of the previous ships had pushed them to commit to more heavy guns for their next class. Even if they were to retrofit the Mareşal Safar al-Aydin-class with heavier guns it would be suboptimal since the finalized design had not been planned with them. For the next class, to get the most out of new advancements in large caliber guns, it would be designed from the beginning to have a large and powerful battery of 8- or 10-inch secondaries. The debate between which caliber to use was of serious importance, as the former would make for easier fire control arrangements given the more distinct difference between 8- and 12-inch shell splashes. However, 10-inch guns promised much greater effect against armor, and with twice the payload per shell, were more likely to land a killing blow if they struck an enemy ship.

Studies were conducted throughout the year of 503, with ships proposed ranging from 16,000 to 25,000 tons. The largest of these studies had mixed batteries of both 8-inch and 10-inch guns supplementing their 12-inch main weapons, but these were determined to be too large and extravagant for even the quality-minded Bahtiyaran Navy. Smaller designs with mixed large secondaries were discarded very early in the process, as they had too few of either sized guns to be effective.

By the winter of 503, the designs had been narrowed down to a series of 20,000-22,000 ton preliminaries, the largest ships that the Divan, the legislative body of the Dominion, would authorize construction of. Of these proposals, these were divided into those that had a secondary battery of sixteen to twelve 8-inch guns, and those that had twelve to eight 10-inch guns. All proposals had at least sixteen 6-inch guns in various arrangements to provide for defense against torpedo boats.

In early 504, the preliminary designs had been narrowed down further to a pair of 22,000 ton finalized ships, ready to be delivered to the shipyards for construction. The funds had been authorized for two ships the previous year, and it was coming time to begin work. Rumors of ships being built in Regia Nautica, Tethyssia and Auspitavia with exceptionally numerous large caliber gun batteries were circulating within naval intelligence, and it was these rumors that pushed the finalized version of these ships to take twelve 10-inch guns as their secondary armament, the heaviest available among the final designs.

The orders were placed with the shipyards in Nassira and Tel Faradh by the spring of 504, and in the fall, the keels were laid. The final specifications called for ships of 22,000 tons normal displacement, with four 12-inch, twelve 10-inch, sixteen 6-inch, and ten 3-inch guns. This would be supplemented by various smaller guns added as the construction proceeded, and six underwater 18-inch torpedo tubes, with four mounted in broadside pairs, one at the stern, and one at the bow. The armor scheme was effectively a repeat of the previous ships, with a maximum of 8 inches of belt armor, tapering to 6 inches at the upper and lower ends; and 4 inches of armor covering the bow and stern with end belts. 8 inches was also the chosen thickness for the barbettes, turret faces, and the conning tower as well. For protection against plunging fire, a modest 1.5 inch deck was placed over the vitals, and a thinner 1 inch deck over the ends. The main battery turret roofs received the same armor as the main deck, as did the conning tower roof. In terms of speed, they retained the 21 knots of their predecessors, and could sail for 5000 nautical miles at a cruising speed of 10 knots.

Work proceeded at a stately pace throughout the first two years. By the end of 506, both ships had been launched, and christened with their names- the lead ship, Osmakoyun Savasi, and her younger sister, Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu. They followed in the tradition of Bahtiyaran Navy naming, in which all ships of a class would be thematically linked to the name of the lead ship. If, for example, a ship were to take the name of a great battle, then all her sisters would be named after its most notable participants, or landmarks within that battle which were important. Likewise, if a lead ship took the name of a famous general, then her sisters would take the name of battles he fought in, or other high ranking officers that served under him with distinction, or alongside him as an equal.
As the new ships were nearing completion towards the end of 506, the Bahtiyaran Navy was confident they were building ships that were, as they always had been, the largest and most powerful in the world of their kind. In one of history’s great ironies, it was true that the Osmakoyun Savasi-class were in fact the largest and heaviest ships under construction at the time, but their size would not spare them from the coming revolution in naval warfare, one that would redefine warships forever.

Just before New Year’s, 506, and only two months before Osmakoyun Savasi was scheduled to finish her construction and begin her builder’s trials, new information was finally obtained about the Regian Savitori-class battleships that shed light on their true nature. Rather than carrying an unprecedentedly numerous battery of mixed heavy guns, as was presumed to be the case, these ships mounted a unified battery of heavy guns, all of the same caliber, designed to fire large salvoes of powerful shells from long range. It was an entirely new class of warship, the dreadnought, and all that came before it were rendered obsolete overnight. And Regia Nautica was not alone in building these ships- the Auspitavians and Tethyssians were likewise constructing this new type of capital ship.

The shift from what became known as pre-dreadnoughts to dreadnoughts was ushered in by the Regia-Eugerian war that had begun in 505 and was entering it’s closing stages by 507. Largely a naval conflict, experience had shown that large caliber guns were proving dominant over smaller weapons in fights between capital ships, and combat ranges were far longer than prewar planners had expected. While Bahtiyaran observers in the conflict had certainly noticed these trends, the Admiralty and the design commission had both underestimated how fast and how strongly the other great navies would react to this new information. Within weeks, the Design Commission had been tasked to develop a dreadnought of their own, and serious consideration was given to converting the Osmakoyun Savasi-class into all-big-gun ships to get a foot in the door on this new dreadnought race.

Two schemes were drawn up for the possible conversion. One entailed replacing the 12-inch main guns with 10-inch guns in the same position, giving the ships a total of ten 10-inch guns firing broadside. The other scheme called for switching out the 10-inch twins for 12-inch singles, giving the ships a broadside of seven 12-inch rifles. Ultimately, the advanced stage of construction of both ships meant that any conversion would be costly and time consuming, and it was decided every ounce of available resources for capital ships would be best used to make the best dreadnought possible on the shortest timetable allowed.

Thus, while obsolete before they were ever commissioned, the two ships of the class were commissioned as the last conventional pre-dreadnought type ships of the Bahtiyaran Navy. On the 32nd of Coniaces, 507 K.E., the battleship Osmakoyun Savasi was officially commissioned into the navy, followed shortly by her sister on the 11th of Oren, 508 K.E. Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu had experienced about two months of delays as the rush to get dreadnoughts under construction had caused shortages of materials, but both would join the fleet two years prior to the arrival of the first all-big gun battleships.

Service Record: Being obsolete upon their commissioning proved fortuitous for these ships. During their first two years of service they sailed the world, their impressive size making them perfect for showing the flag in foreign ports, while their obsolescence made it so that there was little concern about spies learning of their specifics. Throughout 508 and 509 they impressed foreigners, potential allies and enemies alike, with their distinct profile, well-trained crews, and their tumblehome hull form always drew comments. Whether derisive or complimentary, it was always striking in some regard. A third tour was planned for 510 but cancelled due to rising tensions.

On the 34th of Coniaces, 512 K.E., war broke out between Soira and Eugeria, and quickly engulfed their network of allies. The Bahtiyar Dominion went to war on Soira’s side, and the Osmakoyun Savasi-class was transferred to the West Laramidian Sea, where she would be facing reserve units of the Rurikan Confederacy, who had joined the war on Eugeria’s side within hours of the declaration from Soira.

Their high speed for pre-dreadnought ships and their heavy guns made them well suited for gunfire support missions, and almost immediately the two sisters were sent to work. They fired on enemy troops in support of friendly units fighting on the coast, and served as a deterrent against enemy warships attacking friendly formations. Most of the Rurikan dreadnoughts were stationed in the East Laramidian Sea, leaving the Western side of the waterway occupied mostly by pre-dreadnoughts. Occasionally the ships would duel with land-based artillery batteries, and they successfully silenced several of these batteries while only taking light damage from them at worst.

Early in the war, the two ships would see Rurikan naval vessels only twice- the Rurikans made a point of avoiding surface battles on even terms against the Bahtiyarans, and likewise, the Bahtiyarans made a point not to chase down the Rurikans lest they be led into an ambush of torpedo craft or towards minefields. The first engagement, on the 17th of Gilihia, 512 K.E., occurred when three Rurikan pre-dreadnoughts and an armored cruiser sortied out to bombard Bahtiyaran troop positions at the same time as the Osmakoyun-class vessels sailed in company of a scout cruiser squadron with the intent to do the same to Rurikan positions on the other side of the line.

The two sides met and briefly exchanged fire- the Rurikan ships were significantly older and retreated as soon as they identified the ships they were up against. A single hit from Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu struck the funnel of the trailing Rurikan vessel and she began to fall out of line, the loss of pressure in her fire rooms causing her speed to drop. Before the two dreadnoughts could close in for the decisive killing blow however, Osmakoyun Savasi struck a mine and was forced to slow down to help control the flooding. Her sister ship made smoke to cover her retreat, and the two sides disengaged with only one shell hit made by either force. Osmakoyun Savasi limped back to port- her lack of a torpedo defense system meant that the flooding was very severe, and only her sheer bulk gave her the reserve buoyancy to make it home.

By the Spring of 513 K.E. both ships were back in action. Whilst performing their routine bombardment missions, they received word of enemy cruisers harassing Bahtiyaran fishing boats nearby. The two ships made full speed to the scene of the reportings, where a rain squall had moved in, making it difficult to see. After very nearly obliterating the fishing boats that called for their protection (they were briefly mistaken for Rurikan destroyers, but this mistake was fortunately corrected before the ships managed to land a hit), a single ship made itself visible through the dense rainfall. At 2000 yards it was identified positively as a Rurikan protected cruiser, and both ships opened fire with all their weapons at point blank range. The desperate enemy vessel returned fire, and in the ensuing exchange Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu was hit multiple times. After nine minutes, the enemy cruiser exploded in a brilliant fireball, breaking in half and sinking. The two Bahtiyaran battleships only found four survivors in the water after an hour of searching, and with no more enemy vessels sighted nor distress calls from the fishing boats, they headed home.

These two actions would prove to be the only significant surface action these ships would experience. During 514 K.E., the Auspitavian Navy sent reinforcements into the Laramidian Seas, dissatisfied with how poorly the Rurikans and Eugerians had performed against the Bahtiyaran threat. Brilliant intelligence work by the Auspitavians allowed them to stage an interception of a major Bahtiyaran dreadnought squadron that was being evacuated from a port under siege. Three of the four ships in the squadron were sunk, out of a total of twelve in the whole navy at the start of the war. It was a crippling blow, and in the same time period the Osmakoyun-class ships thrice escaped the same fate by brilliantly evading an enemy dreadnought squadron sent to intercept them.

After such a crippling blow followed by many close calls, the Bahtiyaran Navy was confined to port, with its excursions being very limited and cautious, all the way until the tide was decisively turned in late 517 K.E. Several major victories by the Regian Navy, and the Nova Emeraudan Navy, a new entrant into the war, changed the balance of power at sea, and forced the Auspitavian Navy to withdraw its units from the Laramidian seaways in order to focus on defending its own waters. With pressure relieved on the Bahtiyaran Navy, they entered a final period of major activity to provide fire support for many of the late war offensives.

On the 40th of Oren, 518, the guns fell silent. Eugeria and the Rurikan Confederacy surrendered, and the Auspitavians agreed to a separate white peace before any major amphibious operations could be launched against them. For the Osmakoyun class, this meant the end of their active service life. Already deemed obsolete second line ships from the very start of the war, the major advances seen in naval technology and experience gained from combat during the conflict meant these ships had very little further use for the navy in the post-war period. In 521 K.E., Osmakoyun Savasi and Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu were reduced to reserve fleet status.

Several attempts were made to sell the ships to the Cuizāuhraqui Empire after the war, even with promised modernizations that would increase their speed to match their existing coastal defense battleships. These fell through however, and the ships were eventually sold off to an independent Moravia, one of the numerous new states to arise from the ashes of the old empires that fell in the wake of the Great War. With their departure in 525 K.E., the era of pre-dreadnoughts was truly over for the Bahtiyaran Navy. Their service from then onwards would be a relatively quiet life in a small but prosperous nation, lasting all the way to the Second Great War. Osmakoyun Savasi herself would be sunk by a submarine early in the conflict, while Mareşal Serkan Zarakolu would survive the war and be sold for scrap. Pieces of her were recovered by the Naval Museum in Nassira, including her bell and several guns, where they are currently displayed.

Springsharp Data:

Osmakoyun Savasi, Bahtiyar Dominion Battleship laid down 1904

19,748 t light; 21,183 t standard; 22,162 t normal; 22,944 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
(570.00 ft / 570.00 ft) x 81.00 ft x (28.00 / 28.81 ft)
(173.74 m / 173.74 m) x 24.69 m x (8.53 / 8.78 m)

4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 40.0 cal guns - 800.00lbs / 362.87kg shells, 120 per gun
Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1904 Model
2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.00lbs / 226.80kg shells, 150 per gun
Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1904 Model
6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
16 - 6.00" / 152 mm 40.0 cal guns - 100.00lbs / 45.36kg shells, 250 per gun
Quick firing guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1904 Model
8 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
8 hull mounts
20 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 45.0 cal guns - 12.00lbs / 5.44kg shells, 200 per gun
Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1904 Model
20 x Single mounts on sides amidships
8 raised mounts
12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
8 - 1.46" / 37.1 mm 50.0 cal guns - 1.00lbs / 0.45kg shells, 1,000 per gun
Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1904 Model
8 x Single mounts on sides amidships
8 double raised mounts
Weight of broadside 11,048 lbs / 5,011 kg
6 - 18.0" / 457 mm, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m torpedoes - 0.832 t each, 4.992 t total
In 6 sets of submerged side tubes
24 - 18.0" / 457 mm, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m torpedoes - 0.832 t each, 19.967 t total
In 6 sets of below water reloads

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 8.00" / 203 mm 376.00 ft / 114.60 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Ends: 4.00" / 102 mm 205.00 ft / 62.48 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Upper: 6.00" / 152 mm 376.00 ft / 114.60 m 10.00 ft / 3.05 m
Main Belt covers 101 % of normal length

- Hull Bulges:
0.00" / 0 mm 0.00 ft / 0.00 m 0.00 ft / 0.00 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 9.00" / 229 mm 6.00" / 152 mm 8.00" / 203 mm
2nd: 6.00" / 152 mm 3.00" / 76 mm 6.00" / 152 mm
3rd: 3.00" / 76 mm 1.50" / 38 mm 3.00" / 76 mm
4th: 3.00" / 76 mm 1.00" / 25 mm -

- Armoured deck - multiple decks: 1.50" / 38 mm For and Aft decks
Forecastle: 1.00" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 1.00" / 25 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
Direct drive, 2 shafts, 28,940 ihp / 21,589 Kw = 21.00 kts
Range 5,000nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,761 tons (60% coal)

907 - 1,180

£2.258 million / $9.033 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 2,282 tons, 10.3 %
- Guns: 2,257 tons, 10.2 %
- Torpedoes: 25 tons, 0.1 %
Armour: 6,245 tons, 28.2 %
- Belts: 3,197 tons, 14.4 %
- Armament: 1,992 tons, 9.0 %
- Armour Deck: 886 tons, 4.0 %
- Conning Tower: 170 tons, 0.8 %
Machinery: 4,092 tons, 18.5 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 7,054 tons, 31.8 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,413 tons, 10.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 75 tons, 0.3 %
- Hull below water: 25 tons
- Hull void weights: 5 tons
- Hull above water: 25 tons
- On freeboard deck: 10 tons
- Above deck: 10 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
21,539 lbs / 9,770 Kg = 24.9 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.18
Metacentric height 5.0 ft / 1.5 m
Roll period: 15.3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.93
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.68

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck,
a normal bow and a cruiser stern
Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.600 / 0.604
Length to Beam Ratio: 7.04 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23.87 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 43 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 45
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -15.00 degrees
Stern overhang: -3.00 ft / -0.91 m
Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
Fore end, Aft end
- Forecastle: 20.00 %, 23.00 ft / 7.01 m, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Forward deck: 30.00 %, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Aft deck: 35.00 %, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Quarter deck: 15.00 %, 21.00 ft / 6.40 m, 22.00 ft / 6.71 m
- Average freeboard: 21.24 ft / 6.47 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 103.5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 148.9 %
Waterplane Area: 33,768 Square feet or 3,137 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 161 lbs/sq ft or 788 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.77
- Overall: 1.02
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 4th, 2020, 7:12 pm
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Joined: May 25th, 2016, 2:05 pm
Duke of Umbara class battleship

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The Duke of Umbara (occasionally referred to as 'the Umbara class') was a series of three battleships built for the Imperial Antaran Navy. The lead vessel was commissioned in 1305. The Duke of Umbara was designed amid a rapid development and increase in capital ship size that had already been occurring for nearly 30 years. Despite being at the top of her game at the time of her commissioning, she was undergunned just three years later, and made almost obsolescent another three years later, with her successor growing by three thousand tonnes and gaining an additional twin main battery turret.

The Duke of Umbara was an incremental but by no means small upgrade to the Prince Eisen IVs, being the first Antaran capital ship to attain the range that allowed it to operate far out of territorial waters, and as far as the (at the time) Hampton Island - which was critical to the current Empress's future plans for a war with Wesmere. Umbara kept the two twin turret main battery setup, but with a significant increase in her secondary battery. Umbara utilized an unusual combination of superfiring triples, twins and single 203mm guns along with her orchestra of 76mm guns for defense against torpedo boats.

When the Great War rolled around, the class furfilled their intended role and took part in the Battle of Hampton Island, though due to the degree that they were outclassed, they played only a secondary role. Previously during the war, they covered naval invasions in and around the Veravane to which they were most effective. After the war, all members were selected for decommissioning - with St Isaac being stripped of her armament and sunk as a target ship instead.

Ships in class

Duke of Umbara - scrapped, 1324
Chancellor Price - scrapped, 1324
St Isaac - sunk as target ship, 1326

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 5th, 2020, 6:19 pm
Posts: 8
Joined: November 11th, 2015, 2:15 pm
"With the dawn of the Twentieth Century came the recognition that the Deterrent-class 'armored cruisers' of 1886 were virtually obsolescent as a part of the battle line, and even the Stalwart-class ships of 1896 were starting to be rapidly outclassed by foreign battleships. Thus, it was decided that the next class of battleships, due to arrive in 1906, would be designed to be the most powerful, best-protected battleships in the world, cost be damned, in hopes that they would remain effective front-line units for at least twenty years after completion, such that the next class would not be as desperately needed....

"Main and secondary batteries were never really in dispute. By the time serious design work began in 1902, Intelligence had obtained information on the planned characteristics of the British Lord Nelson-class battleships, and believed that the Japanese were working on a similar all-big gun mixed-battery battleship. (In truth, the Satsuma class was intended to be built with a uniform battery of twelve-inch guns, but it ended up being completed as a semi-dreadnought instead due to limitations on Japanese manufacture of large-caliber guns.) These designs would require that any 'superior' design mount a comparable battery, with the standard four 12" guns in the main battery, and twelve 10" guns as a secondary, laid out along the sides of the superstructure in twin turrets....

"There was much argument over the antitorpedo batteries; all agreed that improvement over previous designs was needed, but the debate over the size of the guns required was extremely spirited.... In the end, the arguments in favor of larger, more powerful antitorpedo guns carried the day; the ship would carry the Vickers 4"/50 BL Mark VII as essentially its sole antitorpedo guns, with a quartet of six-pounders mounted atop the main turrets, mainly as a sop to those who still resisted the argument that destroyers were now too large for such guns to be effective. Four of the four-inch guns were to be mounted in the open, in a fairly radical design decision, on the theory that such guns would be more likely to survive an engagement with enemy battleships to defend against torpedo craft looking to finish off damaged ships....

"The design was possibly the most heavily protected of the era. The ship's main belt was to be twelve inches thick, with the upper belt, casemates, and end belts all being six inches. This was originally intended to be standard Harveyized chromium steel, but when Vickers informed the Navy that they had managed to replicate the process for making Krupp Cemented armor, the decision to change to the higher-grade armor was taken with no change in armor thickness.... Deck armor was typical for the era, with a two-inch protective deck over the vitals tapered to one inch over the ends.... For the first time in a TSN design, the ship incorporated a three-inch torpedo bulkhead, inboard of the lower coal bunkers, the full length of the main belt....

"Of course, combining maximum firepower, protection, and speed into a single ship came at one great cost: size. The sheer weight of the guns, armor, and machinery required for such a ship would force it to be easily the largest warship in the world, and indeed make it comparable in size to the great Atlantic passenger liners. Attempts to restrict size were made; the originally planned forecastle was deleted in favor of a flush deck at quarterdeck height, the hull ends were given pronounced tumble-home above the waterline, and, for the first time, extensive use of lightening holes (similar to American, rather than British, practice) was used, all in an effort to reduce the ship's total weight. Further efforts were made by eliminating what the Chief Constructor termed "pointless vanity features" such as the bow decoration and stern walk, though both of these would be forced back upon the Navy by influential politicians during construction.... Despite this, the design still came in at a rather hefty 27,000 tons normal displacement, a size that no other capital ship would reach until the Royal Navy's Lion class battlecruisers six years later.... With such large ships, it was considered advisable to give them a separate flag bridge, based on experience with the Stalwarts showing that the presence of the admiral and his staff on the main bridge caused great congestion and difficulty in operating the ship....

"Fine ships though they were, the design was, however, let down by Naval Intelligence's failure to identify the characteristics of HMS Dreadnought until construction was too far advanced to allow any changes. As a result, the ships delivered in mid-1906 as the most powerful and capable battleships ever built, but would be made instantly obsolete a mere four months later....

"Following the construction of the Protector-class battleships and Alacrity-class battlecruisers immediately after World War One, the Vigilants found themselves relegated to coastal warfare duty, a role they proved admirably well suited to, with their large number of guns of varying calibers and their pre-'All or Nothing' armor layout providing good protection against the lighter guns typically faced in shore bombardment missions. In this role, they served through World War Two, even after the arrival of the ships intended to make them surplus to requirements, the Sentinel class of 1942. One ship, Victorious, was lost in battle off Guadalcanal in late 1942 (see Chapter 6), while the others were decommissioned immediately postwar."

--Quoted from Battleships of the Kingdom of Tet Satou, by Norman Friedman

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Vigilant, Victorious, Vindictive, Tet Satou Semi-dreadnought battleship laid down 1904 (Engine 1906)

23,855 t light; 24,942 t standard; 27,075 t normal; 28,781 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
(515.00 ft / 500.00 ft) x 95.00 ft x (30.00 / 31.62 ft)
(156.97 m / 152.40 m) x 28.96 m x (9.14 / 9.64 m)

4 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 849.99lbs / 385.55kg shells, 110 per gun
Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1903 Model
2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
12 - 10.00" / 254 mm 45.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 84 per gun
Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1901 Model
6 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
12 - 4.00" / 102 mm 50.0 cal guns - 31.00lbs / 14.06kg shells, 200 per gun
Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1904 Model
12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
4 - 1.85" / 47.0 mm 50.1 cal guns - 3.31lbs / 1.50kg shells, 300 per gun
Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
4 x Single mounts on centreline, evenly spread
4 double raised mounts
4 - 4.00" / 102 mm 50.0 cal guns - 31.00lbs / 14.06kg shells, 200 per gun
Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1904 Model
4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
4 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 9,909 lbs / 4,495 kg
Main Torpedoes
4 - 18.0" / 457 mm, 11.67 ft / 3.56 m torpedoes - 0.509 t each, 2.035 t total
submerged side tubes
2nd Torpedoes
12 - 18.0" / 457 mm, 11.67 ft / 3.56 m torpedoes - 0.509 t each, 6.105 t total
below water reloads

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 325.00 ft / 99.06 m 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
Ends: 6.00" / 152 mm 174.98 ft / 53.33 m 16.00 ft / 4.88 m
Upper: 6.00" / 152 mm 325.00 ft / 99.06 m 20.00 ft / 6.10 m
Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead - Strengthened structural bulkheads:
3.00" / 76 mm 325.00 ft / 99.06 m 28.69 ft / 8.74 m
Beam between torpedo bulkheads 80.00 ft / 24.38 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 12.0" / 305 mm 12.0" / 305 mm
2nd: 10.0" / 254 mm 10.0" / 254 mm 10.0" / 254 mm
3rd: 6.00" / 152 mm - 6.00" / 152 mm
5th: 2.00" / 51 mm - -

- Armoured deck - multiple decks:
For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
Forecastle: 1.00" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 1.00" / 25 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 12.00" / 305 mm, Aft 12.00" / 305 mm

Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29,709 ihp / 22,163 Kw = 20.00 kts
Range 10,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,839 tons (67% coal)

1,054 - 1,371

£2.331 million / $9.325 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 2,086 tons, 7.7 %
- Guns: 2,074 tons, 7.7 %
- Weapons: 12 tons, 0.0 %
Armour: 11,008 tons, 40.7 %
- Belts: 5,232 tons, 19.3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1,035 tons, 3.8 %
- Armament: 3,027 tons, 11.2 %
- Armour Deck: 1,247 tons, 4.6 %
- Conning Towers: 466 tons, 1.7 %
Machinery: 4,108 tons, 15.2 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 6,353 tons, 23.5 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,220 tons, 11.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 300 tons, 1.1 %
- Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
33,336 lbs / 15,121 Kg = 38.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 13.8 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.24
Metacentric height 6.9 ft / 2.1 m
Roll period: 15.2 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.46
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.53

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck,
a ram bow and a cruiser stern
Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.665 / 0.671
Length to Beam Ratio: 5.26 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.36 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -15.00 degrees
Stern overhang: -7.00 ft / -2.13 m
Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
Fore end, Aft end
- Forecastle: 20.00 %, 24.00 ft / 7.32 m, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m
- Forward deck: 30.00 %, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m
- Aft deck: 35.00 %, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m
- Quarter deck: 15.00 %, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m, 22.00 ft / 6.71 m
- Average freeboard: 20.47 ft / 6.24 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95.6 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 133.3 %
Waterplane Area: 36,890 Square feet or 3,427 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 164 lbs/sq ft or 799 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.93
- Longitudinal: 1.99
- Overall: 1.00
Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
Excellent accommodation and workspace room
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Ship statuses:
Vigilant decommissioned 1946, in reserve to 1952, to museum/memorial 1954
Victorious sunk by Japanese torpedoes off Guadalcanal, 29 September 1942
Vindictive decommissioned 1946, in reserve to 1952, scrapped 1955

(Don't you love it when a ship you've been art-blocked on for a year ends up being perfectly suited to a new challenge? Great way to get you off your butt and back to work!)

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 13th, 2020, 4:32 pm
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Posts: 8505
Joined: December 15th, 2010, 10:13 pm
Location: Behind you, looking at you with my mustache!
This one will not fit 100%, but nah :D

I just put something together, wasn't going for something at all.

"Hotel with guns!"

Basic numbers:
Length: 140 meter
beam: 23+ meters
depth: 8.1 meter
Displacement: around 15000-18000 tons
Speed: in +- 18 knots
Propulsion: 3 screws, 3 engines, 18 boilers, 24000 hp
Range: +- 5000 nmi
Crew: 38+845

2 X twin 13.1" guns (Center turrets)
4 X twin 8.5" guns (wing turrets)
8 X single 6" guns (casemate)
16 X single 3" guns (casemate)
8 X single 3" guns (on deck)

Belt: from 220 mm, to 280 mm
Turrets: 300 mm and 180 mm
Barbette: 325 mm
Deck: from 35 mm, to 55 mm

[ img ]

(I have no problem with people kitbashing my drawing)

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 24th, 2020, 6:30 pm
User avatar
Posts: 4485
Joined: July 27th, 2010, 5:10 am
Location: Finland
Contact: Website
[ img ]

Displacement: 18,950 t full load
Lenght: 138,98m OA
Beam: 24.6 m
Draught: 8.1 m
Propulsion: 2-shaft vertical tripple expansion engines, 24 boilers, 20,000hp
Speed: 18,5-19 kts
Crew: 890

Belt: 100 - 220 mm
Conning tower: 220 mm
Turrets: 220 mm
Deck: 35-55 mm

2x2 305/45 mm
4x2 254/45 mm
20 120/45 mm
4 456 mm TTs

Coming next for 2021/22: Project 1143 complete redux: Pr1143.4 and 1143.4.2 & Preparations for Pr.61 Remakes

Shipbucket mainsite, aka "The Archive"
Submit your drawings to the archive here
Far Eastern AU wiki

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 24th, 2020, 7:36 pm
Posts: 1492
Joined: June 3rd, 2011, 10:42 am
The last battleship design of the Russian Empire and first and only Pre-dreadnought class of the Great Russian Union. Using a mix of French and native design practices as well as some British Weaponry the Rurik class was meant to be the strongest battleships possible at the time. But like so many designs of the time Dreadnought's arrival made them obsolete before they even left the yard.
Laid down in mid-1905 just after the end of the Russo-Japanese War in an attempt to save face for the Empire but the incompetence of the young Tsarina proved too much and both the people and Army revolted later that year. But construction of the four ship class wasn't slowed by political events as the new government knew that the Navy was a laughing stock and needed to regain prestige.

Built rather quickly for a Russian battle line unit for the time the four ships completed between late 1907 and early 1908.
All ships would see action in the First Great War though mostly for neutrality patrols in the Baltic before all four ships were moved to the Black Sea Fleet for the remainder of their careers

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Displacement: 22,500 tons standard
Lenght: 530.5 feet
Beam: 88.5 feet
Draught: 29.5 feet
Propulsion: 3-shaft vertical tripple expansion engines, 30 boilers, 25,000hp
Speed: 20 kts
Crew: 900 officers and mn

Belt: 150 - 280 mm
Conning tower: 305 mm
Turrets: 305-150 mm
Deck: 75 mm

2x2 305/45 mm
6x2 203/50 mm
20 x 1 150/45 mm
4 x 1 75/52 mm
4 456 mm TTs

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 25th, 2020, 10:15 am
Posts: 376
Joined: November 15th, 2012, 8:36 am
Location: California, USA
Contact: Website
(AU) Grosserdeutschland, Rheinland Class Predreadnought (1906-1908)
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Follow up from the Braunschweig class in OTL (Replaces Deutschland class). Inspiration was a combination of the Deutschland class and Nassau class design studies, tried to keep it true in form for tonnage and armament; in addition to some Austro-Hungarian design flavor thrown in. Of course, it is the last Pre-Dreadnought type ship in-universe.

First capital ship I've completed in SB, and good luck to everyone else in this challenge :D

FD Worklist
Me-262 Series
Fw-190/Ta-152 Series
Germany AU Thread
Luft '46 Thread

List of Aircraft with Acquired Data (Updated) ... 80#p123956

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Kiwi Imperialist
Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 25th, 2020, 12:02 pm
Posts: 103
Joined: December 10th, 2014, 9:38 am
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Named after a prominent noblewoman born in the 10th century, Réina Ermengarde was one of four pre-dreadnought battleships authorised by the parliament of Burgundy in 1902. Construction began in 1904, but progress was slow. The yard responsible for her construction had never built a battleship before. Battleships were previously ordered in pairs, with a four-ship fleet deemed sufficient. The authorisation of 1902 aimed to create an eight-ship fleet and left those yards with experience at full capacity. Réina Ermengarde was commissioned in 1908, though this was largely a political manoeuvre. She was not fit for active service until 1910, at which point she joined the 2nd Battleship Division and served alongside her sisters: Rèi Conrad, Réina Adelaide, and Rèi Rodolfo. All four ships were built to the same design, and are generally considered to be members of the same class. However, a number of minor differences were introduced by each yard during construction.

Battleships of the Royal Burgundian Navy were traditionally designed around Mediterranean service. Burgundy’s colonies beyond the Suez Canal and the Strait of Gibraltar, such as the Middle Congo, were too small to warrant a battleship presence. Réina Ermengarde and her sisters were no different. They lacked the range required for true oceanic sailing and did not provide a comfortable freeboard in harsh weather. Réina Ermengarde had a normal displacement of 15,255 long tons (15,500 t). Boilers fired by coal and oil drove triple-expansion steam engines producing 13,850 hp (10,320 kW). These engines powered two shafts in turn, and could propel the ship at a speed of 18 knots (33 km/h). The main armour belt was comprised of Krupp cemented armour 12 inches thick. Armour of the same type and thickness protected the 12-inch guns. The 10-inch guns were protected by 8 inches (203 mm) of armour, while 6 inches was used to protect other areas such as the waterline beyond the limit of the main belt.

The main battery consisted of four 12-inch (305 mm) guns in twin turrets, and eight 10-inch (254 mm) guns in four single turrets and two twin turrets. This strange arrangement of the 10-inch battery was a compromise between survivability and weight. The selection of a 10-inch gun instead of 6-inch (152 mm) pattern found on earlier battleships represented a shift in thinking. War planners of the Royal Burgundian Navy expected greater naval combat to occur at ranges greater than previously anticipated. This was based on analyses of the Spanish-American War, which concluded that long-range engagements would have been favoured if training and equipment had allowed for it. The 12-inch guns were expected to reliably penetrate the main belt of the Italian Regina Elena class at 5000 yards, while the 10-inch guns were deemed sufficient against Italian armoured cruiser belts at the same range. The secondary battery consisted of seventeen 3-inch (76 mm) and four 1.9-inch (47 mm) guns. Eight guns of the 3-inch battery were mounted in forward and rearward firing casemates near the bow and stern of the ship. The 1.9-inch guns did not last long in service and were removed in 1912. Réina Ermengarde also possessed four 18-inch (450 mm) torpedo tubes fitted below the waterline.

Burgundy remained neutral during the first three years of World War I. Réina Ermengarde sailed between Burgundy and its Mediterranean possessions, principally Corsica and Tunisia, many times during this period. These patrols acted as a show of force, a threat to any combatant who might target neutral Burgundian shipping while contesting Mediterranean. They also offered additional opportunities for training. The Burgundian economy experienced a severe downturn as the war went on. While the Allied powers were eager for arms, coal, and other war necessities, their exports dwindled. Areas of industry dependent on foreign imports stalled and the production of consumer goods dwindled. This led to the collapse of the Burgundian government in late 1916. Aggressive, nationalistic elements emerged at the forefront of Burgundian politics and made a fateful decision in May 1917. The German ambassador to Burgundy approached the new government with a proposal. Revolution had broken out in Russia, mutinies had erupted in the French army, and the Italian army had failed to achieve a decisive blow against the Austro-Hungarian Empire. The war would soon be over. If Burgundy entered the war on Germany’s side, ending the war before the United States could delay its inevitable conclusion, it might be rewarded with French and Italian territory on the European continent and in Africa. Burgundy was in the perfect position, separating southern France from northern Italy. If they held in the west and pushed in the east, Italy's war effort would collapse and the comparatively small Burgundian army would then be supported in its efforts against France by the Central Powers. The Burgundian government agreed and planned to enter war on the 1st of September. Unfortunately for Burgundy, British intelligence assets soon learned of the plot.

A joint Anglo-French naval force bombarded the home of the 2nd Battleship Division, Toulon, on the 18th of June. Réina Ermengarde sustained light damage during the attack. Her sisters fared worse. Réina Adelaide sank at anchor while Rèi Conrad and Rèi Rodolfo were heavily damaged. The Burgundian fleet, taken by surprise, was in no position to retaliate and responded with sporadic secondary battery fire. The bombardment was an unprecedented threat which hoped to dissuade the government of Burgundy from joining forces with Germany. The gamble failed. Réina Ermengarde was ordered to raise steam and plot a course to Tunisia. She would join the four older battleships of the 1st Battleship Division at Tunis and prepare for war. This was, however, largely a political move. The commanders of the Royal Burgundian Navy were not swayed by reports of an imminent Allied collapse originating from Germany. The French, British, and Italian navies were in a superior position everywhere, not just in the Mediterranean. They had no intention of wasting the fleet at sea. Réina Ermengarde sortied against the occasional cruiser threatening Tunis, and even succeed in sinking the French ship Dupleix, but these actions were less about contesting the Mediterranean and more about preventing another devastating bombardment.

Réina Ermengarde shelled a French colonial force approaching Tunis from Algeria in December. Tunisia was expected to fall in February 1918, and Réina Ermengarde would have likely been scuttled if it were not for the fact that the Burgundian government surrendered in January. The impact of the French mutinies had been exaggerated and the arrival of American forces allowed France to divert troops from quieter sectors to the Burgundy border. Austria-Hungary was on its last legs and Italy was able to divert forces to stall the Burgundian advance. With Switzerland physically blocking any support from Germany, the Burgundian army had no choice but to mount a fighting withdrawal after the first month of war. In March, Réina Ermengarde was boarded by a detachment of French marines in Tunis. In the Treaty of Arles, she was formally awarded to France. The French navy had little use for a pre-dreadnought, let alone a foreign one with different weapons and equipment. Réina Ermengarde was sunk as a target in 1922.

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Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 25th, 2020, 7:41 pm
Posts: 28
Joined: July 22nd, 2017, 1:29 pm
The defender of the Qing Empire, Jiyuan Class Battleship

Jiyuan Class Battleship,were a class of 2 Battleships ordered by the Imperial Chinese Navy to rebuild the navy with modern tech and tactics after its disastrous defeat in war against Japan in 1895,which the modern Beiyang fleet were completely destroyed and humiliated to ashes.This defeat triggered a large scale of modernization campaign by new modernist faction within the Empire and with now strong backing of reformist Guangxu Emperor which regain its control after the deposed and execution of Empress Dowager Cixi,which were view as corrupt,incompetent and even worse were effectively hindering the modernization effort of any field in China,which were view as a key factor to China's defeat against Japan.Emperor then ordered a massive reforms and conduct diplomatic effort to gain an alliance with western power to help China rebuilt its navy and modernize its which the Germans and French were willing to do to counterbalance the evergrowing closer relation between Japan and British Empire

A major rearmament programme were commenced in 1900,this include to rebuilt the navy into modern standard with newest ships and tactics,this dictated that new 7 Battleships to be commenced into Navy by 1910 and a lot of cruiser and Destroyers.One of those were Jiyuan class which were the second class of pre-dreadnoughts battleships to enter the new modern Chinese Imperial Navy

Jiyuan Class were born from the 1904 requirement of having a suitably armed battleships with reasonable displacement and if necessary the ability to construct the ships in new German joint-ventured shipyard in Dalian,the German Blohm und Voss company proposal were accepted in 1905 and the construction of Jiyuan were carried out in Germany,while her sister ships Jingyuan were built in China.The reasons why China insisted on building the Jingyuan in China is because the rumours that Japanese were building 2 of British designed battleships,which turned out to be a merely hearsay

Jiyuan were laid down in 1905 and were completed in October 1906 and were commissioned in 1907 although her sister ships,Jingyuan were only entered service in 1909 because of the delay at building such a huge ships in China,but she became the first battleships built in Asia,caught the Japanese by complete surprise

[ img ]

Jiyuan have a displacement of 16.500 t and were 136 meters long and have a beam of 23,3 meters.she was powered by 20x Coal firing boilers with 3 Boveri Reciprocating triple-expansion steam engines and delivering 16.560 ihp through 3 shafts capable of propelling her up to 18,3 knots and have a range of 6.900 nm at 10 knots

Jiyuan primary punch pack were 4 305mm mounted in 2x twin turret designed by Krupp.Her armament were primally optimized not only against the Battleships but against a smaller torpedo boats and cruiser.This was adopted from hard lesson Chinese learnt from Japanese during 1895 war when swarm of smaller torpedo boats were overwhelming the Battleships.So the Chinese opted for a very strong secondary armament of 12x 210mm gun in unique configuration of 8x single turret and 2x twin turret,this configuration were choosen to optimize the firing arc of the each gun and capability to act more independently against armoured cruisers and torpedo boats,compared to all twin mounts common to foreign designs.It is also furthered supplemented by 16x 150mm guns mounted in casemated to deal with smaller destroyer and torpedo boats and if it doesnt enough were further reinforced by 23x 88mm rapid firing cannon to deal a hail of shells against torpedo boats.She also have a 4 450mm underwater torpedo tubes.

She bear a pretty strong armour configuration of 220mm main belt armour,150mm upper belt,110mm ends,50mm all deck,230mm main turret face,200mm main turret side,230mm main turret barbette,100mm face turret secondaries and 200mm conning tower.overall she was heavily armoured.

Jiyuan spent most of her carrier at Beiyang fleet located at Weihaiwei and when the Great War comes,China quickly turned their back on Germans and in 1915,were involved at battle against German Far-East squadron Armoured Cruiser off Macau and successfully sink the Cruiser Scharnhorst.After the Great War she was relegated to secondary duty as modern dreadnought battleships were now taking her place in Imperial China Navy.But in 1926 she was involved at putting the anti-emperor rebellion at Shenzen and were successfully shelled and destroyed the rebel held Ammunition warhouses,which put the deathly blow against the rebel that were led by Chiang Kai-Sek,which were demoralized and hide in Korea after the failed rebelion.

Jiyuan were decommisioned by 1931 and were kept as a floating barracks until she was sank by Japanese air attack in 1941 during Second China-Japan War

Thats all :)

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Armoured man
Post subject: Re: The Last Pre-dreadnought battleship ChallengePosted: February 25th, 2020, 8:26 pm
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Posts: 259
Joined: June 7th, 2016, 4:53 pm
Princess Amelia class battleship

looks like I just need a couple of hours to spare.

[ img ]
the Princess Amelia class was a group of two battleships built for the Shausal Republic Navy she was commissioned at a time of rapid naval development that have been occurring for the last 20 years and for a brief time was considered the most powerful battleship in the world, however as the size of Battleship main guns and battleship displacement continue to rise she would quickly become undergunned and quickly obsolete in the span of only 6 years with her successor growing by 4000 tonnes and gaining an additional two twin turrets.

Amelia class was designed as a replacement for the previous Queen Tara which by 1803 were very much obsolete and outdated, design at a time of rapid naval development meant that princess Amelia class could benefit from some of the newest technological innovations in capital ship construction with the biggest advantage it's over predecessor being the incorporation of superfire and turrets into her design which at the time were a relatively new concept that was first developed by the imperial Ōyashima navy on its MiKasa class battleship.

throughout the first couple of years of the 18th century Amelia and her sister ship prince Sebastian would spend most of their time patrolling Shausal straights however with the start of the second Eastern powers War her and her sister ship would partake in their intended role as battleships for the first and only time in their service lives, on the 16th of April 1812 princess Amelia and Prince Sebastian with both partake in what would ultimately be the deciding Factor in the conflict the Battle of Cape Horner against the Midland Royal Navy, with the battle being a decisive victory for Shausal Republic Navy, the war would end six months later on the 16th of September 1812.

after the war the ships continued to serve however by 1822 they were woefully outdated by comparison to many of the newer capital ships coming into service at that time so as a result in 1823 both members of the class were selected for decommissioning and scrapping

Displacement: 16,422 tons standard, 17,799 tons normal
Dimensions: 507ft x 79.5ft x 27ft
Machinery: 2-triple-expansion steam engines, 16 coal fired boilers, 17,500 shp
Speed: 19 knts
Endurance: 7,000 nautical miles at 10 knots
Armor: 250mm main belt, 180mm belt ends & upper belt 305mm MD turret face, 280 MD sides, 254mm barbettes, 220mm 8" turret face, 110mm 8" sides, 70mm decks, 25mm forecastle & quarterdeck, 300mm CT, 220mm S.CT

2x2 305mm/40 MK-02
6x2 203mm/45 MK-3
16x1 75mm/50 MK-98

Ships in class: (laid down-launched-commissioned - fate)

Princess Amelia (BB-6) 1798-1802-1803 - decommissioned on the 21th of December 1823
Prince Sebastian (BB-7) 1799-1803-1804 - decommissioned on the 25th of December 1823

Work list: 1. various pre-1900 Zipang ships 2. Haruryū class battlecruiser 3. Some protected cruisers and other miscellaneous projects

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