right. not that bad an start, although I did not get that impression on first sight, to be honest.
so, yeah, I have a few comments.
I hoped so!
first of all, maybe the harshest of all. start over with the hull. now, don't be mad, but this won't really work. the bow and stern have ridicolour angles, the beam will result in stability problems and the beam shown in your cross section will not be enough. that is the reason it looked really bad at first
The underwater hull, stern and bow, are both just notational. If the angles need to be modified I can do so. The bow is intentionally extended out to give the eventual weapon placed there as much coverage abaft of beam as possible. This is just the frigate so the blind spot is just a reality of being a smaller ship (the follow on destroyer will have two weapons fore and aft for 360 coverage). I will play with it.
As for beam you have me curious because I intentionally used the Absolon and Perry to get comparable proportions.
Absalon = 137.6m long by 19.5 on the beam (7.05:1), draft 6.3
Perry = 136m long by 14m on the beam (9.7:1), draft of 6.7m
FFLX = 130.1m long by 18.75 on the beam, (6.93:1)draft 7.9
I am pretty spot on the Absalon, the Perry is just a skinny ship. The dimension I am off on is draft, is that what you see as the problem? Or perhaps the shape of the hull? Does it need to be wider below the water line?
This is definitely something I can alter.
but, I am impressed though by the work that is, to me, the most important. thinking about what you want it to be. there are some flaws, but hey, you are new, that is only natural.
a few comments then, to help you out.
* you mention the zumwalt has 2 FT30. this is true. these are the zumwalts propulsion engines..... and the zumwalt is huge. I think maybe tripple the displacement of this vessel. so, normally, you would need at most half that power for propulsion.
now let's list the power of the engines used:
- FT-30, 40MW
- Caterpillar Marine V16M32C, 7,680 MW
-an burke has, total power, 2,5 MW*3 generators and 20MW*4 on propulsion. this is 7,5 MW and 80 MW respectively.
-the zumwalt has 78MW in gas turbines and I guess about 10 MW from her auxilary generators. this all goes in the electrical network, as she uses IPS, but the gas turbine power shall mostly be used for propulsion, as otherwise she wouldn't get to 30 knots
-an perry has 31 MW propulsion power and I think about 5 MW in auxilary power.
*your vessel is closer to size to an perry. that means you would need about 40MW maximum for propulsion. a single FT30 would be enough for that.
*you have now on board: 2* 7,680 MW + 3*40MW= 135,36 MW. this means you have 135-40=95MW of power purely for weapons.
*based on some press articles about them, I have estimated the power of an railgun to be about 10MW per second. per second of constant firing, that is. but they don't fire constant.
'10 projectiles a minute, with an speed of let's say, 8000km/h, a barrel of 10 meters, that gives that the projectile is 'being fired' for 1/800000h or 0,0045 seconds, 6 times a minute. that is 1,62 second per hour, so you would need to generate 16MW/h roughly. I would not think lasers would use 5 times as much as that, but if they do, I suggest going nuclear, because you are going through your fuel real fast this way.
so, I think your power is a bit too much
bringing this down would make your ship way easier to lay out too.
Yeah, like I mentioned I have struggled with this decision. Some things:
1.) While the Zumwalt only has two FT30s (I am assuming this is the designation for the generator version of the MT30?) and is easily twice the size of the FFLX, the LCS-1 also rocks two MT30s and is much smaller. So that is where the third came from, because the LCS-1 uses its two MT30s solely for propulsion. Of course the difference is that the DDG1000 (and the FFLX) uses IPS and the LCS-1 doesn't.
2.) The diesels were envisioned as actual backups, not something to be used even under battle load. Only if the gas turbines are non functioning. If one FT30 at 40MW is whats needed to just run propulsion, that means that as backups both diesels together can only provide 15MVs (or less than half the needed power for full propulsion) in an emergency. Basically that would let you run minimal propulsion and still have 80MWs available for full weapons load with one FT30 down, or give you full power to engines for an escape with 15MW available to run non energy self defense weapons with two FT30s down.
Of course this is just a frigate so it makes sense that it was not rivaling a destroyer in power generation. It the end it looks like its the LCS-1 that is insanely over powered. Then again it has a top speed of 47knots and probably isn't using that efficiently due to lack of IPS.
I will delete the aft MT30 and move the forward two back to better align them under the stacks. This will change my philosophy about the FFGX because it was going to have only two MT30s (to provide redundancy, it doesn't have energy weapons). I wonder if that hull can get away with one?
I am going to leave you with that now, as it is time to sleep at my side and I don't want to spill too much at your plate at once, but just a few pointers
- look at hull shapes of vessels in the bucket. ships look alike.... because they work.
Could you be a bit more specific about whats wrong with my hull? I got the dimensions right in the middle of real world frigates, is it the hull form that is the problem?
- keep an eye on your fuel quantity. right now you seem to have just enough to get out of port and back in, if I see it correctly.
Is it really that bad? I got the tank locations from how they sit on a Arleigh Burke. I can fit another large tank under GEN RM #3 but that will interfere with the shafting potentially. You have to have fuel though!
- battery power! you will need to charge, fire and recharge your energy with these future weapons
The forward weapon will run directly off the generators so no insane amount of batteries needed (remember I was going to have 80MW, now 40MW, of extra power generation). The amidships CIWS weapon will need lots of bateries and they will be in the deck below. It uses the batteries to create a split second ionization laser that requires power beyond what even three FT30s could provide. But again, only for a split second. The destructive energy flows directly from the generators, to be managed by the WMS between the CWIS and bow laser.
- get your engines and weapons sorted, and then dimension the ship around it. keep in mind that I for example see no room for crew currently, so most likely with the same weapons your ship will end up bigger
Its there, the profile shot doesn't give you a good perspective of the space around the machinery. I'll do a seperate graphic to show this once the engineering is settled.
- try to replace systems like the VLS and the gun with the new weapons, instead of adding them on spaces kept empty. that will save you a lot of weight and space when the ship is build and will stop you running into problems when your new weapons are fitted
Yep, but this isn't a "best I can think of" design, but rather one that is designed to fit into the scenario which really isn't that far from the truth other than we will be saddled with the POS LCS. Which means that the FFLX needs to have legacy weapons at least until 2022 and once installed why take them off (perhaps the new builds will not include them).
What do you think about reducing the VLS from 64 to 32. Its still a more than the Perry's zero!
A valid point, though, I need to look at ballasting until the bow laser and gear are installed, it won't affect the FFGX.
- you forgot to add the generators at the gas turbines
Yeah, I am still looking for a good image. If anyone has one I will gladly draw it.
ow and, I really want that electrical engine, it's specifications and any references for it, if possible. my knowledge and resources of those are very limited but my interest in it is high.
I also would love to see those cat engines for the belowdeck part thread.
Not a problem, I'll post them in the below deck parts thread.
hope this helps
Your comments are great, I plan on spending a lot of time on this ship, both inside and out.