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Vote for the best design
Poll ended at November 8th, 2018, 4:08 pm
Hae Maelstrom by Rowdy36  3%  [ 2 ]
Lockheed C-80 Murciélago by Rundrewrun99  1%  [ 1 ]
Mitsubishi A17M1, Type 44 Naval Fighter by Charguizard  20%  [ 14 ]
Yakolev Yak-45 by Hood  10%  [ 7 ]
VAI Naval Fighter by Novice  0%  [ 0 ]
de Havilland Vandal by Blackbuck  1%  [ 1 ]
Rockwell F-19A Hussar by Ilamaman2  1%  [ 1 ]
Westralian Aircraft Consortium Thresher by thegrumpykestrel  4%  [ 3 ]
Lockheed F5V-1A by RaspingLeech  1%  [ 1 ]
Hispano Aviacion HA-1000 Astral by Yuqueleden  3%  [ 2 ]
SOKO Super Orao by Nestin  0%  [ 0 ]
F84 Seahawk by Miklania  0%  [ 0 ]
SCI T3S Siolpaire by Garlicdesign  23%  [ 16 ]
YJ76 Lynx by Obsydian Shade  0%  [ 0 ]
Arsenal Aeronautique/Hawker Siddeley Gerfaut by reytuerto  1%  [ 1 ]
Timoshenko Ti-12 by APDAF  0%  [ 0 ]
Walraven MA-6 Griffin II by pegasus206  0%  [ 0 ]
SOKO L-20K Belorepan by Gollevainen  10%  [ 7 ]
Messerschmitt Me 1260 by TigerHunter1945  4%  [ 3 ]
Sea Lightning FG.2 by Deskjester  13%  [ 9 ]
Fighter Challenge by Skyder2598  0%  [ 0 ]
TF-20 Pangolin by Navybrat85  0%  [ 0 ]
ICAR K-83 μάντα by Wariterm  0%  [ 0 ]
VF74V by Kannevets  0%  [ 0 ]
Aérospatiale-Dassault Menace C by VictorCharlie  1%  [ 1 ]
GE/BAE F/A-21 Gryphon by Sareva  1%  [ 1 ]
Total votes: 70
Author Message
Garlicdesign
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 20th, 2018, 11:34 am
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Hi all!

An early version of this plane was posted before for the Thiariaverse, but as it fitted the challenge like a glove, I thought I might include it here (BTW, the competition is as stiff as ever, congrats to all contributors):

SCI T3S Siolpaire (Vampire)
Thiaria was forever banned from the possession of aircraft carriers in the 1946 peace treaty with the UN. Forever turned out to last till 1962, when the Kennedy administration, which regarded Thiaria as the most stable and reliable democracy in South America regardless of its somewhat unsavoury history, lifted the last restrictions on Thiarian military acquisitions, except of course nuclear weapons. Virtually days after, the Thiarians asked for the sale of one or (preferably) two Essex-class carriers, several of which had been decommissioned as surplus and were berthed in various US ports. In the immediate aftermath of the Cuban missile crisis, any move that would increase US influence in South America was popular in the US, and USS Tarawa (CV-40) and USS Rotuma (CV-47) were transferred to Thiaria in 1964 in a disarmed state and renamed LT Oirion (Orion) and LT Abhainn (Eridan). After much political turmoil in the late 1960s and early 1970s, Oirion was rebuilt into a full-fledged fleet carrier in the 1970s and commissioned as such in 1976. Her initial air group consisted of Sciroccos, Etendard IVMs (later replaced by Br.120 Orfraies), Alizés and Super Frélon helicopters, all purchased in France. The Scirocco, while being a good fighter, had only a primitive radar and little growth potential and would need replacement in the mid-1980s at the latest. Thiarian interest in Sea Jaguar, which the Indians had successfully adopted after many difficulties, was vetoed by the British, and the US were still miffed by Thiaria’s Soviet adventure and refused to deliver even something as old as used Crusaders. This left Thiaria with but one choice: develop their own carrierborne air superiority fighter.

Fortunately for them, their economy was in its best-ever shape when the decision was due in the late 1970s. A steep rise in oil prices since 1974 had fueled a huge economic boom; their oil revenue had increased by 720% in five years. Developing a carrierborne fighter for a single flattop which would be capable of taking about 25 – 30 of them was an obvious exercise in waste, but Thiaria’s ambitions were not limited to a single carrier. The construction of two more of 50.000 tons each between 1985 and 1990 was part of all long-term plans since 1977, and with a requirement if at least 150 fighters, plus possible land-based versions to replace the Tearatoirn and the Soviet supplied MiG-21, the project began to make sense economically. The specification was based on intelligence reports about the upcoming US F/A-18, but with a clear focus on fleet air defence. Only SCI made a proposal, and development commenced in 1978. The first prototype had its maiden flight in November 1982, a year before the F/A-18 was accepted into service. Five more followed till October 1983 for an intense trials program lasting two and a half years.
[ img ]

The Thiarian plane was somewhat smaller, lighter and more compact than the Hornet, with a single tail and double delta wings allowing for excellent maneuverability and slightly higher speed (Mach 2,0 at optimal altitude). Advanced FBW steering allowed for good low-speed characteristics. The plane was powered by two SCI RT4S turbofans rated at 48 kN without and 75 kN with afterburner; they were thoroughly modern designs with somewhat better fuel efficiency than the Hornet's F404 engines. Although internal fuel capacity of the Thiarian airplane was less than the Hornet's (in absolute terms; compared with the plane's dry weight and internal volume, the percentage devoted to fuel tanks was higher), range was roughly the same (3.500 kilometers ferry range, 500 - 850 kilometers combat radius depending on armament). The radar and electronics suite gave full air to air, but only limited air to sea capability; the main radar was a Thiarian development of the French RDI installed in the Mirage 2000, and the plane was equipped with IRST allowing it to engage air targets in a wholly passive mode. The plane, which had a very wide landing gear for optimum stability on a moving deck, could employ Matra Super 530D and Magic 550 AAMs and carried a French DEFA 554 cannon in the port wing strake. Combat load was significantly lower than F/A-18s at only 5.000 kilograms due to the focus on air superiority, and there were only three main hardpoints (one under the fuselage and two under the wings), plus four more which were only suitable for AAMs or lightweight electronics pods. Ordnance was initially limited to bombs (dumb or laser guided, using an external laser pointer), unguided Rockets and AS.30 ASMs which required no radar guidance from the launch platform. During trials, it was found that some more wing area was needed for low-speed performance, the cockpit could use a larger canopy for better all-round visibility, and the best place for the advanced radar warning and jamming system was the top of the vertical stabilizer (which now was 5,02m high, barely clearing LT Oirion’s 5,50m hangar roof); IRST also was only added halfway through trials. Otherwise, few faults could be found. The first production order of 64 units was placed in May 1986 for $24M per airframe. The type received the designation T3S (T = Trodai (Fighter), S = built by SCI, 3 = 3rd design by SCI to be adopted by the Thiarian military) and was officially christened Siolpaire (literally: Gulper, a Vampire-like mythical creature originating in pre-colonial Phoenician folk lore; although monstrous, the Gulper was perceived as a protective spirit sent by the Phoenician god Reshef to haunt native American enemies of the Carthaginian settlers) in 1986. The first series aircraft were delivered in October 1988. The initial production run (40 T3S-1 single-seaters and 24 O3S-1 conversion trainers) was complete in June 1990.
[ img ]

Exports of T3S-1/O3S-1 were limited to 24 (18/6) machines ordered by Argentina in 1990 and delivered in 1992 through 1994; only half of them were carrier capable. The Argentine Siolpaires were cheaper than the original due to subsidization (unit cost $20M), and most of the original French-sourced avionics and weapons were replaced with a mix of obsolescent gear and Israeli and South African copies due to the ongoing EU arms embargo against Argentina. In Argentine Service, Siolpaire did not achieve FOC prior to 2000 and was never rated as satisfactory as the Thiarian original. Although Argentina no longer operates aircraft carriers, the ten remaining Navy planes (in their magnificiently old-fashioned liveries) are regularly practicing carrier operations from Thiarian carriers. Despite becoming obsolescent in 2018, there are no modernization plans for Argentina’s Siolpaires due to the country’s deteriorating economy.
[ img ]

A land-based export version dubbed T3S-2/O3S-2 scored a spectacular export success in 1987 when 64 (48/16) were ordered by Finland. By that time, the strong dollar allowed the Thiarians to undercut the $24M charged by the US for the F-18; they charged $20M per plane. In addition, the Finns liked the fact that Siolpaire came from a non-aligned country, as they had to be conscious not to piss off the still existent Soviet Union. T3S-2 differs from T3S-1 by having a simplified landing gear, non-folding outer wings and an electronics and sensors suite more tailored to air-to-ground missions including a built-in laser designator (which would later appear on the naval T3S-4 as well). The outer wing weapons stations were strengthened and their load capability tripled; total payload was increased to 6.500 kg. They also had US-sourced APG-65 radars with full air and ground attack capability. They were delivered in 1990 through 1992, 12 complete and 52 in kits to be assembled by Valmet. The only other customer for T3S-2 was the Swiss Air Force, which received 8 complete (4/4) and 36 license-built (28/8) T3S-2/O3S-2 between 1996 and 1999 for a total of 44; the decision for Siolpaire was made on the same basis as Finland’s, as the Swiss preferred a design from a non-aligned nation. Unlike the Finnish version, the Swiss Siolpaires were air-to-air only; they had conformal missile bays in the fuselage, which would later become standard in Thiarian versions as well. In addition, the Swiss Siolpaires were fitted with US sourced F404 engines, with similar performance. Unit cost was $24M, more than the Finnish version, mostly due to inflation.
[ img ]

By the late 1980s, the Thiarian Air force was interested in a land-based strike version of Siolpaire to replace its decrepit Tearatoirn light attack planes. This batch (T3S-3 resp. O3S-3) had Antilope 50 radar and no capability to fire BVRAAMs; normal armament comprised guided bombs, Durandal runway-busters and AS.30, AS.37, AJ.168 and ARMAT air-to-ground missiles. 48 (24/24) T3S-3/O3S-3 were ordered by the Thiarian Air Force in 1990 and delivered in 1992 through 1994. Export orders for T3S-3 came from Argentina (24 (18/6) ordered in 1992 and delivered in 1995 through 1996) and Ecuador (12 (9/3) ordered 1995 and delivered 1997/8). All of these are slated to remain in service indefinitely at the moment, as neither country has any money for a replacement. A late customer for this very simplified version was Indonesia, which ordered 20 (16/4) T3S-2/O3S-3 in 2003 and received them in 2006/7. Unit cost varied between $18M and $23M.
[ img ]

Meanwhile, the Thiarian Navy needed more Siolpaires as well. The first ship of the follow-on carrier class (LT Treighdin (Plejades)) was completed in 1994, and the second one (LT Chros Deiscirt (Southern Cross)) in 1997. A repeat order of 80 (64 single-seaters and 16 double seaters) was placed in 1994 to replace the Br.120s and the remaining Etendard IVMs at an unit cost of $32M. They were delivered to the Thiarian Navy between 1997 and 2000. This batch (T3S-4 resp. O3S-4) were fitted with RDY radars, internal laser targeting systems, additional automatic chaff and flare dispensers, internal jamming gear that made external jamming pods redundant, a glass cockpit and improved passive sensors; they had the ability to fire MBDA Mica AAMs, for which hull conformal launchers were introduced, AM39 Exocent ASMs, supersonic SCI-MBDA ANS ASMs from 2005, plus a new generation of guided bombs (with exchangeable Laser, TV or (from 2005) GPS guidance) needing no external guidance pods.
[ img ]

The corresponding land-based version was called T3S-5/O3S-5. They had the same avionics and radar as the naval T3S-4 and were fully multirole capable; they could carry all ordnance of T3S-3 and T3S-4. Unlike the earlier land-based planes, T3S-5 had arrestor hooks and carrier-strengthened fuselages and undercarriages, so they could be employed afloat if the navy took heavy losses and needed replacements quickly. 120 (104 single-seaters including 40 dedicated defence suppression aircraft and 16 double-seaters) were ordered in 1995 to replace first the remaining MiG-21s and then the T1S Ionadh fleet. They were delivered between 1998 and 2002 at a unit cost of $30M ($40M for the SEAD version). T3S-5 was more successful on the export market than earlier versions. South Africa replaced her worn-out Mirage F1s with 24 (18/6) T3S-5/O3S-5 on a 1-for-2 basis. Their 1997 order was delivered between 2000 and 2002. Chile – which had wanted the cheaper F-16, but was repeatedly turned down by the Clinton administration over human rights issues – ordered the first 12 of an eventual total of 52 Siolpaires in 1999. They all were on T3S-5/O3S-5 standard (40/12) and were delivered between 2002 and 2007. In 2001, Mexico bought an initial batch of 30 T3S-5/O3S-5, plus 30 more in kits for local assembly and a production license for another 60, making that country the largest foreign customer. Deliveries to Mexico (96 single-seaters and 24 double-seaters) started in 2004 and were complete in 2012. Local license production was slow and troublesome, requiring much Thiarian assistance. In 2018, 105 Siolpaires are essentially the whole combat inventory of the Mexican Air Force.
[ img ]

Poland rather surprisingly ordered 48 Siolpaires in 2005. The Polish version is dubbed T3S-6/O3S-6 (36/12) and has US sourced radars (APG-79), avionics and engines (F414), and are adapted to US armament; otherwise, they resemble T3S-5. The Polish Siolpaires have the best power-to-weight ratio of all versions and possess Mach 1.2 supercruise capability. Deliveries (8 complete planes and 40 kits) were between 2007 and 2009 for a heavily subsidized price of $36M per unit.
[ img ]

After delays in the adaptation of Thiaria’s 5th generation fighter T8S Asarlai to carrier operations, a total of 104 naval Siolpaires (including 12 ex-Air Force machines) were upgraded from 2008 through 2014 (new designation T3S-7); 24 new T7S-7 were delivered in 2008/9 (unit cost $42M) for a total of 128. T3S-7 had a new AESA radar (similar to the French RBE), completely new ESM, voice control and helmet display, uprated RT8S engines (60/90 kN) with Mach 1.2 supercruise capability, optional conformal fuel tanks, two additional hard points at the wing roots and a strengthened airframe; they were adapted to SCI-MBDA Super Mica ER and Meteor AAMs (from 2020), SCI-BGT Polyphem (from 2010) ASMs, SCALP land-attack missiles (from 2010) and SCI-BGT ARMIGER anti-radar missiles (from 2015).
[ img ]

The Thiarian Air Force launched a mid-life modernization programme of its 96 remaining T3S-5s to the performance level of the T3S-7 (but with improved RBE-3 radars) in 2015; this will be complete in 2020. All T3S-5 will then carry the new designation T3S-8. The remaining T3S-3 are not being modernized; they are currently in the process of being replaced by Barracuda UAVs and will be sold or cannibalized.
[ img ]

Production is complete in 2012 after 26 years and 774 units built (including prototypes), of which 688 were built in Thiaria, 36 in Switzerland and 60 in Mexico. As of 2018, Siolpaire is the most prolific jet fighter in the Americas south of the Rio Grande. The type is expected to remain in service on board Thiaria’s carriers till 2024. The Thiarian Air Force will not begin to phase out the Siolpaire before 2030. The last units of the type are expected to remain in Thiarian service till 2038 at least, giving the Siolpaire a service life of nearly 50 years; some export customers plan with them until well into the 2040s. If the 5th generation Asarlai programme proceeds as planned, many relatively new Siolpaires will be available on the second-hand market; Colombia, Croatia, Bulgaria and Angola have already expressed interest.

Data
Crew: 1
Length: 16,20m
Wingspan: 11,00m
Height: 5,02m
Wing area: 45m²
Empty Weight: 9.600kg (T3S-7/8: 10.250kg)
Loaded Weight: 14.500kg (T3S-7/8: 15.200kg)
Max Takeoff Weight: 19.550kg (T3S-7/8: 22.200 kg)
Fuel Capacity: 4,500kg internally (plus 2x 1.600kg conformal fuel tanks on T3S-7); O3S (all versions) only 4.000kg internally
Powerplant: 2 x SCI RT4S afterburning Turbofan (48kN dry / 75kn with reheat); 2x 2x SCI RT7S (60/90 kN) on T3S-7 and -8; GE F404 (49/79kN) on Swiss and GE F414 (62/98 kN) on Polish machines

Performance
Max Speed: Mach 2 (2,160km/h) at 10.000m, Mach 1,2 (1,480km/h) at sea level; T3S-6: Mach 2,2 (2.380 km/h) at 10.000m
Cruise Speed: Mach 0,9 (970 km/h) at 10.000m; Mach 1,2 supercruise (1.300km/h) at 10.000m from T3S-6
Combat Radius: 850km air-to-air, 500km with full weapons load (T3S-7/8 with conformal tanks: 800km with full weapons load); O3S (all versions) 450km fully loaded
Ferry Range: 3.500km (T3S-7/8 with conformal fuel tanks: 4.800km); O3S (all versions): 3.000km resp. 4.200km with conformal fuel tanks)
Service Ceiling: 15,000m
Rate of Climb: 245m/s (T3S-6: 280 m/s, T3S-7/8: 265 m/s)
Wing Loading: 385kg/m² at MTOW
Thrust/weight: 1,05 loaded (1,20 in T3S-7/8)
Maximum g-load: +9/-3g

Armament
Guns: 1 x DEFA 554 30mm with 280 rounds of ammunition
Hardpoints: 4 wing (2 wet) [6 on T3S-7], 1 centreline (wet) and 2 waist [conformal from T3S-4] with a capacity of 5,000kg of ordnance [6.500kg on T3S-7]
Stores (Thiarian Navy Service)
T3S-1: Matra Super 530F and Matra 550 Magic AAMs, AS.30 ASMs, dumb bombs, laser guided bombs
[ img ]

T3S-4: Mica AAMs, AS.30 and SM.39 ASMs, dumb bombs, laser/TV/GPS guided bombs
[ img ]

T3S-7: Mica, Super Mica ER and Meteor AAMs, ANS, SCALP and Polyphem ASMs, ARMIGER ARMs, Bkp-90 cluster glide bombs, laser/TV/GPS guided bombs
[ img ]

Avionics
RDI or RDY or RBE-1/3 or Antilope 50 or APG-65 or APG-79 (depending on version and user) radars, IRST; internal Laser RF/designator and TV bomb guidance from T3S-4

Greetings
GD


Last edited by Garlicdesign on January 27th, 2019, 11:13 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Rhade
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 20th, 2018, 4:26 pm
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Holy Omnissiah, I can't compete with quality designs of such magnitude. :shock:

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Obsydian Shade
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 24th, 2018, 12:09 am
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Well, not up to the standard of the other amazing designs here, but I wanted to contribute, and I had this (albeit it in a cruder form) floating around in my archives:

[ img ]

The Lynx was The Grand Duchy of Pallamara's attempt to produce an affordable alternative of the American F-14 Tomcat, for the new carriers which entered service in the late 1970s and early 80s. The first examples were delivered in 1981, and were powered by General Electric F404 engines, though this was an interim solution as the powerplant the aircraft was designed to take was the Pratt & Whitney PW1120 engine which became available from 1985. Armament was two 25mm cannon, 4xSkyflash or Sparrow AAMs and 4xSidewinder missiles. As a dedicated fleet defender, there were no provisions for air to ground armament. There had been early interest in the Foxhunter radar, but the actual set procured was the AN/APG-63 PSP. The design was able to benefit from the British Frazer-Nash hydraulic trapeze, that enabled the missile's firing envelope to be widened.

The first combat action occurred in 1982, when Pallamara unexpectedly contributed a carrier action group to the British task force, however, confined its actions to providing defensive air cover to the fleet. At the the time, there were fewer than 20 Lynx in service, all of which were embarked, along with nearly all the available E-2 Hawkeye AEW platforms. The combination proved decisive however, and resulted in over 40 confirmed Argentinian aircraft kills to no losses, and prevented what might have otherwise been heavy casualties to the fleet. The Lynx would continue to see action in Libya, the Persian Gulf, Balkans and other hotspots. Originally, 72 aircraft were to be procured, however, the number was cut to 54, in favor of the more flexible and versatile conventional winged variant which supplemented, then replaced it. The aircraft would be retired in 2005.

Special thanks to Rowdy36 who helped greatly with the original version of this design, and to Deskjetser on the SB Discord for helping to organize my thoughts on the final result.

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 29th, 2018, 7:20 pm
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Ok guys few more days left to post your challenges. I will post mine in wensday and all posts done until thursday are accepted. Unlike other challenges, no panel will judge these drawings but instead I will post a poll with all participants included and let the people have the power!!!

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reytuerto
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 29th, 2018, 10:25 pm
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Good afternoon, guys! Well, here is my candidate, a modest candidate, for a modest navy, by an equally modest artist: Arsenal Aeronautique - Hawker Siddeley Gerfaut, a supersonic jump jet, here shown in the air defence configuration with 2 Sidewinder Lima and 2 Skyflash missiles, and 125 rounds per gun, in the mid 1980s. [ img ]

Specifications:

Crew: 1
Length: 16.25 m
Wingspan: 10.10 m
Empty weight: 7800 kg
Maximum weight: 14.500 kg.
Engine: Rolls Royce Centaurus II 4 moving nozzles turbofan, only the posterior nozzles had afterburner 30,000 lbs with full reheat (24,000 lbs dry).

Performance:

Maximum speed: Mach 1.45 at 30,000 feet
Combat radius: 300 nm with 4 missiles.

Armament:

Guns: Two DEFA 30 mm automatic cannons each with 125 rounds
Hardpoints: 6 under wings (two wet).
Missiles: Sidewinder L , SkyFlash, Kormoran, Maverick, Alarm.
Other weapons: SNEB 68 mm rockets, Paveway guided bombs, GP free fall bombs, Durandal bombs
Avionics: Modified LM Ericsson's PS-46/A radar


Historical Notes:

The Admiralty felt that a CATOBAR carrier would be an impossible adquisition for the navy, so the only feasible replacements for the current WWII era flattops were "baby carriers" coupled with a jump jet fighter/attack aircraft. After several proposals Arsenal Aeronautique choose Hawker Siddeley HS1179 as basis for the new fighter. Mainly built with titanium alloys, it was a light but strong aircraft. First flight was in 1978, the full production begun in 1981. The model was cleared for deck service in 1984. It usually operates in a short take off-short landing pattern, instead the STOVL used by the less capable Harrier.

Cheers.


Last edited by reytuerto on October 31st, 2018, 8:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Deskjetser
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 30th, 2018, 8:08 am
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Gollevainen wrote: *
Unlike other challenges, no panel will judge these drawings but instead I will post a poll with all participants included and let the people have the power!!!
I beg of you please don't make this a popularity contest :cry:

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 30th, 2018, 8:50 am
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isent popularity contest what this is all about? Im confident that our memberbase have good taste and knowledge to give fairly objective judging that wouldnt differ much from spergy exelsheet calculations.
;)

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odysseus1980
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 30th, 2018, 8:55 am
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I like very much that last design. Roundel seems very similar with real world Portugese one.


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Deskjetser
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 30th, 2018, 9:26 am
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I disagree. I simply think the few judges taking the time to look at each entry and giving a score, not just a yes or no vote, is a far superior method. Whats with the change?

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: Fleet Air defence fighter of 1980 challengePosted: October 30th, 2018, 10:30 am
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Change of the judging method? There are no Sb rules regarding the challenges, only some sort of contiunity from challenge to challenge. In order to improve the entire experience, we need to try different alternatives. In past, finding judges have been almost as burdensome as contributing into the challenge itself, so alternative approaches deserve to be examined. If we rely on few selected members on judging, and who cannot participate into the challenge itself, we really quickly run out of candinates and/or end in situation, where few "perma-judges" handles all the challenges and therefore affect on their quality. Good old democratic voting is always going to be most objective way of getting the winners out

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