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heuhen
Post subject: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 17th, 2020, 9:14 am
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After the Helge Ingstad accident (Norwegian frigate), the Norwegian "Boss" of the Norwegian military put forward his suggestion to what the government ned to invest in the future, on the list was that he want minimum 2 frigate maximum 4 frigate in addition to the existing 4 frigates.

Norway prefer to have as much as possible similar, to make it easy on logistics and maintenance... But it's almost impossible to get parts for Fridtjof Nansen class (parts have to be specially made)

There haven't come any decisions yet. But they want jump on a future frigate program.

What frigate program do you think i would be on the list of suggestions?

A Norwegian magasin have suggested MKS180 from Damen since it's a German project and Norway have good connection with Germany, due to the submarine program.

And also, what equipment/electronic/weapons would you think a future Norwegian frigate would carrying?

Sorry for some mistakes with my English, is fast writing while the CNC-machine on a long program!


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Eeo
Post subject: Re: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 18th, 2020, 8:20 am
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There are a few realistic contenders out there.

The German MKS-180, as you stated. However, the recent German F125 frigate programme has had some difficulties (acceptance of the lead ship being rejected by the Bundeswehr) which might sour this option a bit. We also do not operate any other German systems in the surface Navy, which might be a downside as you need to introduce a new logistics system for this.

The British Type-26 or Type-31 frigate projects. Ongoing production lines, close allies since antiquity. Downside is British systems, which are finicky. Since we're Norway and cheap as fuck, we'd probably go for Type-31 and slap MK41 and NSM on it. Que Norwegian pseudo-Iver Huitfeldt class (which IMO is what we should have bought ages ago).

The US FFG(X) competition is still ongoing. The advantage of piggy-backing off the Americans is 1) economy of scale; 2) American combat systems, which we use on the FNAN today and like very much; 3) politics.

Those are my thoughts anyway.


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JSB
Post subject: Re: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 18th, 2020, 10:34 am
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Eeo wrote: *
..
The British ....Type-31 frigate projects. Ongoing production lines, close allies since antiquity. Downside is British systems, which are finicky. Since we're Norway and cheap as fuck, we'd probably go for Type-31 and slap MK41 and NSM on it. Que Norwegian pseudo-Iver Huitfeldt class (which IMO is what we should have bought ages ago).
....
I think that would be the ideal with a mix of links to Denmark, Britain and US who are all close and allies and if they can keep it closer to Iver Huitfeldt class it should work and be quicker into service and cheaper than anything else?

Its also likley that UK would like to to get a first export customer especially a NATO one for a ship sold as a export version and to increase its own order size spreading development costs, so 4 ships for Norway would be very welcome and might agree a good deal?

The other question is if you could build a Type 31 - Iver Huitfeldt class without doing it all in UK at high local pay rates by building much of the blocks in Estonia and Lithuania and maybe paying a more advanced defence yard to simply do the final integration and fit out? This might still be agreed by UK as it would not get in the way of the T31 order and might allow them do join in to reduce costs as well by the back door by doing the same?

Or just pay Denmark and build a ship without UK as I'm not sure who actually owns the rights to what?


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heuhen
Post subject: Re: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 18th, 2020, 2:43 pm
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There is many possible ways, but if Norway go the crazy way... buy them self into a program, get the hull build and install rest in Norway. Norway do have some expertise, but that would be more expensive.

It's after all cheaper to just expand on the original build order.


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Rhade
Post subject: Re: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 20th, 2020, 9:19 am
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I would propose Naval medium frigate based on Belharra.

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Miklania
Post subject: Re: Just some fast question on Norway possible future frigate!Posted: January 30th, 2020, 3:15 am
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MKS 180 is designed by Damen and Lurssen and is to be built by Blohm+Voss, while the troubled F125s were designed and built by ThyssenKrupp. Hopefully those quality issues wouldn't impact the MKS 180, and it doesn't look like the issue of extremely questionable design philosophy should either.

FFG(X) would be nice, but at $800-950 million a piece it is only cheap by American standards.

Type 26 is attractive because it is also extremely capable, and is available in three different flavors: British, Canadian (probably the most attractive to Norway), and Australian. Downside is that it is also on the expensive end of the spectrum.

Denmark hasn't build an IH in several years, and it's hard to tell what the status of the yard is for new work on that design. Modified Type 31 would be a viable concept, and there are probably a variety of options for building them, though the British would likely push to do it all in Britain.

More frigates from Navantia seems unlikely for a variety of reasons. I don't think they and the Norwegian Navy are on the best of terms.

I vote the Finnish Pohjanmaa for dark horse contender. It would make quite a bit of sense: developed by a friendly neighboring country with a similar operating environment, built around familiar and well-liked Swedish and American weapons and combat systems, and on the less expensive side. Going for the 4 + 4 option would be more likely than with a larger frigate like the Type 31e, and definitely FFG(X) or Type 26. Despite being called a corvette, at about 3,900 tons it really is a small frigate. On the business side, Rauma Marine has a good reputation and has not had publicized quality issues like the Norwegian Navy had with Navantia or the German Navy with ThyssenKrupp.

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